Reply to: Diane Abbott loses Whip after racism row...

[BlueSharp]

Regardless of whether what she wrote is racist, it shows an incredible lack of judgement and her belief in a hierarchy of racism, something she has been accused of for years. Both of these are entirely unacceptable for someone who a few years ago would have been the home secretary.

[malvolio]

Even if the points you are trying to make are actually valid (not saying that is the case here) it's just a dumb place to go for anyone in public office. There are some things you just cannot safely discuss these days - I think that's very bad but unless you are willing to risk your career over principle it's just silly to even tackle the issue. No matter how well carefully you present it, you will be torn to shreds by anyone who sees gain in diminishing you.

More to the point, why would anyone want someone with the lack of wit to produce such a statement anywhere near the wheels of government? It's an indictment of Starmer that she is still in the party just as much as Sunak's sacking of Raab on the basis of political expediency (or cowardice, if you want to be blunt. In both cases).

[d000hg]

Agree it was a calculated comment and some subjects need to be avoided. Suggesting racism has different grades dependent on the "race" , religion or colour you are if you are an MP seems a good one to avoid.

Even if the points you are trying to make are actually valid (not saying that is the case here) it's just a dumb place to go for anyone in public office. There are some things you just cannot safely discuss these days - I think that's very bad but unless you are willing to risk your career over principle it's just silly to even tackle the issue. No matter how well carefully you present it, you will be torn to shreds by anyone who sees gain in diminishing you.

[SueEllen]

FFS - She sent the letter twice.

https://www.thejc.com/news/politics/...fU9P5xJloIPUEa

Diane Abbott’s “antisemitic” letter was sent to the Observer twice from the MP’s own email account a week before it was published, the JC can reveal, raising new questions about her claims that it was just a “draft”.

The letter was identical each time it was sent, three hours apart, and the suspended Labour MP made no efforts to revise it in the seven days after it was sent.

The fact that it was sent from her own email address – not from one controlled by an aide – suggests that she was entirely in control of the process.

The first time the email was sent, the JC understands, Abbott received an automatic reply asking her to send it again but this time with the addition of a postal address. She did this, leaving the text of the letter unchanged.

[SueEllen]

If this had been a live interview, I'd be a bit more sympathetic. However, this was a letter which she chose to send to the newspaper, so she could take her time to phrase it right and/or ask someone else to proof-read it.

(As for the whip, I believe that's only temporary while Labour investigate, so it's entirely possible that she'll get it back.)

Rupa Huq lost the whip over what she said about Kwasi Kwarteng and got it back 6 months later.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-b1064394.html

[vetran]

If this had been a live interview, I'd be a bit more sympathetic. However, this was a letter which she chose to send to the newspaper, so she could take her time to phrase it right and/or ask someone else to proof-read it.

(As for the whip, I believe that's only temporary while Labour investigate, so it's entirely possible that she'll get it back.)

Agree it was a calculated comment and some subjects need to be avoided. Suggesting racism has different grades dependent on the "race" , religion or colour you are if you are an MP seems a good one to avoid.

[hobnob]

We can't all spend weeks researching what we say and things can be interpreted in ways we didn't mean.

If this had been a live interview, I'd be a bit more sympathetic. However, this was a letter which she chose to send to the newspaper, so she could take her time to phrase it right and/or ask someone else to proof-read it.

(As for the whip, I believe that's only temporary while Labour investigate, so it's entirely possible that she'll get it back.)

[WTFH]

Whether true or not, there is nothing to suggest she was deliberately being anti-semitic.

Problem is that there are various media outlets who want to keep pushing "Labour = anti-semitic", and so they have to do something when anything like this happens.

[xoggoth]

Losing whip is over the top. We can't all spend weeks researching what we say and things can be interpreted in ways we didn't mean. She was saying, from a black lady's perspective, that blacks experience more racism than the others mentioned. Whether true or not, there is nothing to suggest she was deliberately being anti-semitic.

[SueEllen]

People like Abbot consider Jews as white, so antisemitism isn't racism. White supremacists consider Jews to be non-white.

Schrodinger's Whites - https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-abbott-letter

[David71]

White supremacists consider Jews to be non-white.

A lot of Jews also consider themselves to be non-white. It's always sparked a discussion in our household when filling in the 'diversity' bit of various forms, my kids generally put 'white' but I know a lot who don't.

And then we have Sephardic Jews....not a 'white' face amongst them.

[NotAllThere]

"It is not enough to say that, actually, Jews or Travellers aren’t really white. One must instead commit to the view, however much it upsets certain contemporary pieties, that white people can experience racism."

People like Abbot consider Jews as white, so antisemitism isn't racism. White supremacists consider Jews to be non-white.

[hobnob]

I read an interesting article about this:
Systemic obfuscation | Samuel Rubinstein | The Critic Magazine

Final lines:
"It is not enough to say that, actually, Jews or Travellers aren’t really white. One must instead commit to the view, however much it upsets certain contemporary pieties, that white people can experience racism."

[Gibbon]

Is there any evidence that Pakistani grooming gangs were given a free pass?

Rotherham report 'reduced me to tears', says MP who exposed abuse decade ago | Rotherham | The Guardian

keighley grooming 2005 - Google Search

[vetran]

Is there any evidence that Pakistani grooming gangs were given a free pass?

https://lmgtfy.app/?q=pakastani+groo...ored+by+police

So if you want to ignore the PM, the Rotherham police chief, the lady who fought to bring it to light, the victim's testimonies, the Prosecutor and government reports no evidence at all.

Oh except its in the BBC so its Gospel.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65174096

Sadly there is poor data collection around ethnicity.

Political correctness gone bad!