Public sector contracting

[kingcook]

So Govt, is moving to a new framework for hiring contractors called Contingent Framework One (CL1).

Everyone on the old Capita systems should be getting an email if they haven't already with the new contract. It looks horrible and makes repeated references to "The Temporary Worker".

Anyone else received it yet?

Nope

[shookshiver]

I received this from agency

.......
As your recruitment agency, we want to ensure we provide relevant information to you resulting from the UK Government’s plans for new legislation.

You may already be aware, and you may also hear in the 2014 Budget statement, that HMRC are introducing a Bill that is intended to clamp down on false self-employment of onshore workers.

In its current form, the Bill requires recruitment agencies (employment businesses) to verify the tax payments of workers that are placed on contracts with their clients. HMRC have stated that they have no intention to alter the operations of Limited Company (Personal Service Company) workers: however, the wording of the legislation is ambiguous in this respect. As members of the Association of Professional Staffing Companies (APSCo), xxxxx Recruitment is participating in the consultation to seek guidance and clarity from HMRC on the practical implications of the legislation.

On 10th March, HMRC announced that the necessary guidance and clarity would not be available to recruitment companies before the budget statement.

As a result, we want to assure you that when you hear reference to this legislation in the Budget Statement, xxxx Recruitment will continue to consult with APSCo and HMRC, to ensure that current ambiguities within the legislation are resolved.

You do not need to take any action at this point in time, we will provide updated communications as clarity emerges over the coming weeks.

Regards

[DaveB]

So Govt, is moving to a new framework for hiring contractors called Contingent Labour One (CL1).

Everyone on the old Capita systems should be getting an email if they haven't already with the new contract. It looks horrible and makes repeated references to "The Temporary Worker".

Anyone else received it yet?

Bad form to quote yourself but...

Having had a chat with one of the chaps at a well known tax consultancy their opinion is that the contract is a bit crap. Formal response to follow. Emphasises even more the need to make sure working practices are properly managed.

The story is that someone in Government got their knickers in a twist over contractor-agency contracts not reflecting the back end contracts with govt departments and so insisted they be flowed down without bothering to think it through or re-write them, so now we have end contracts written from the point of view of client-agency being imposed on contractor-agency relationships and references to temporary workers left right and centre.

No chance of getting it reviewed, hence the focus on working conditions.

[SteelyDan]

Bad form to quote yourself but...

Having had a chat with one of the chaps at a well known tax consultancy their opinion is that the contract is a bit crap. Formal response to follow. Emphasises even more the need to make sure working practices are properly managed.

The story is that someone in Government got their knickers in a twist over contractor-agency contracts not reflecting the back end contracts with govt departments and so insisted they be flowed down without bothering to think it through or re-write them, so now we have end contracts written from the point of view of client-agency being imposed on contractor-agency relationships and references to temporary workers left right and centre.

No chance of getting it reviewed, hence the focus on working conditions.

Just been looking thru a Cabinet Office document on this...sad I know...but like you have mentioned, it's riddled with AWR and Temp Worker references.

Interesting bit was "The Service Provider (this is the Agency) shall ensure that there is an obligation on the Temporary Worker to allow the Customer (Pub Sec Client) to seek assurances that tax and National Insurance has been paid in accordance with all HMRC taxation rules".

It does say though on page 116 that: "The tables below shows the Temporary Worker roles which are in/out of scope for the Contingent Labour Services;

In Scope: Operational and Support Staff

Out of Scope:
· Consultancy.
· Permanent roles including fixed term appointments.
· Admin/Clerical Staff and Junior Managers
· Interim managers.
· Specialist contractors Including “niche” roles, executive/board roles and highly specialist unique roles. e.g. a specialist area of expertise which only a few candidates would be able to fill."

http://ccs.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/site...203%20Hays.pdf

[DaveB]

Just been looking thru a Cabinet Office document on this...sad I know...but like you have mentioned, it's riddled with AWR and Temp Worker references.

Interesting bit was "The Service Provider (this is the Agency) shall ensure that there is an obligation on the Temporary Worker to allow the Customer (Pub Sec Client) to seek assurances that tax and National Insurance has been paid in accordance with all HMRC taxation rules".

It does say though on page 116 that: "The tables below shows the Temporary Worker roles which are in/out of scope for the Contingent Labour Services;

In Scope: Operational and Support Staff

Out of Scope:
· Consultancy.
· Permanent roles including fixed term appointments.
· Admin/Clerical Staff and Junior Managers
· Interim managers.
· Specialist contractors Including “niche” roles, executive/board roles and highly specialist unique roles. e.g. a specialist area of expertise which only a few candidates would be able to fill."

http://ccs.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/site...203%20Hays.pdf

Superb Spot! Thanks a lot. I'll take it up with the agency and see what happens. Based on that I should not be on this contract (and nor should most of my colleagues).


Edit:

Arse, thats the version specific to Hays, I contract through Capita. Their version is almost the exact opposite.

[SteelyDan]

Superb Spot! Thanks a lot. I'll take it up with the agency and see what happens. Based on that I should not be on this contract (and nor should most of my colleagues).


Edit:

Arse, thats the version specific to Hays, I contract through Capita. Their version is almost the exact opposite.

No, it appears to be the same for Capita - "2.2.5 The Service Provider shall ensure that there is an obligation on the Temporary Worker to allow the Customer to seek assurances from the Temporary Worker that tax and National Insurance has been paid in accordance with all HMRC taxation rules"

Also see page 116 for In/Out of Scope:

http://ccs.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/site...1%20Capita.pdf

However, interestingly:

Table 1: Role Scope

In Scope:
· Interim managers.
· Specialist contractors Including “niche” roles, executive/board roles and highly specialist unique roles. E.g. a specialist area of expertise which only a few candidates would be able to fill.

Out of Scope:
· Consultancy.
· Permanent roles including fixed term appointments.
· Admin/Clerical Staff and Junior Managers.
· Operational and Support Staff.

[DaveB]

And as you were.

It seems that this one got escalated sharpish once the extent of the problem was realised. I wont go into details but "business continuity" became a concern.

Previous (IR35 safe) Capita contract reinstated for 3 months while they sort it all out.


Interestingly the call off contract would have put us inside the AWR as well, meaning we'd be entitled to holiday and sick pay and other benefits. I'm pretty sure that wasn't the original intention!

[quackhandle]

Got a call from a pimp (Hays) about a Town Council gig, 6months, usually swerve PS gigs but, having read previous few pages would seem to be okay and I don't have to put myself above the parapet to HMRC so to speak. Mentioned it to the pimp and as usual has no clue on this.

I have downloaded the link from Mal but 214 pages, what am I looking for in that? Also a PCG member and have PCG+ cover.

Thanks

qh

[malvolio]

Got a call from a pimp (Hays) about a Town Council gig, 6months, usually swerve PS gigs but, having read previous few pages would seem to be okay and I don't have to put myself above the parapet to HMRC so to speak. Mentioned it to the pimp and as usual has no clue on this.

I have downloaded the link from Mal but 214 pages, what am I looking for in that? Also a PCG member and have PCG+ cover.

Thanks

qh

In that case, perhaps read the update on the main PCG website and ask any questions on their boards

[quackhandle]

Cheers Mal.

qh