Gaza blockaded

[NotAllThere]

Hamas are terrorists. They rule Gaza. They chose to mount an attack against Israel where they were mandated to murder, torture, kidnap and rape.

I went past a pro-Palestine rally today. "From river to sea, Palestine will be free". Hmm. What does that mean? That the Gaza Strip and the West Bank will be part of a free, fully functioning democratic society that Israel as it is now would like to be?


Or one where Jews don't exist and there is Islamic rule. (Which with Hamas, as with ISIS, means exterme interpretations of Sharia Law)?

[vetran]

Hamas are terrorists. They rule Gaza. They chose to mount an attack against Israel where they were mandated to murder, torture, kidnap and rape.

I went past a pro-Palestine rally today. "From river to sea, Palestine will be free". Hmm. What does that mean? That the Gaza Strip and the West Bank will be part of a free, fully functioning democratic society that Israel as it is now would like to be?


Or one where Jews don't exist and there is Islamic rule. (Which with Hamas, as with ISIS, means exterme interpretations of Sharia Law)?

Indeed they have had decades to come to the table and talk just like the IRA they refused. The only way to bring them to the table is to make them realise they can't win the war.

If Israel disappears then the Muslim Middle East will descend into internecine warfare with you are a Sunni Muslim, I hate you because I am a Shiite Muslim etc. currently they have a common-ish enemy.

[mudskipper]

Anyone still believe in a benevolent loving God?

[Zigenare]

Anyone still believe in a benevolent loving God?

Millions of Christians, millions of Jews, millions of Moslems - that's part of the problem...
(Other religions are available but I'm sure you get the picture...)

[NotAllThere]

Anyone still believe in a benevolent loving God?

Yes, thank you. And in free will, and the basic evilness of the human race.

[mudskipper]

See this is what I genuinely don't get. The God that you (as a Christian) worship is the same (Abrahamic) God that Jewish people and Muslim people worship. Even within flavours of religion there is fighting and hatred - Catholic v Protestant, Sunni v Shiite etc... Surely a loving God isn't insecure enough to really be that fussed if you pray on the wrong day or facing the wrong direction, or via the wrong intermediary? I mean you can't all be right - you presumably believe that the way to heaven is via Jesus - is God really gonna say "feck off" to someone who has lived a good life, trying to honour God, who believes that Mohammed is the right way? Do you really think that if you were born in a different culture, you would have somehow found the 'true' way and rejected the teachings of the society you were born into? You can't all be right? Where is God in all this - has he bitten off more than he can chew? When it was Adam, Eve and a few dozen descendants he was all good, but it's all got a bit out of hand? Or is he just bored with it all?

[JustKeepSwimming]

This is getting really worrisome now.

Mob of 100s of muslims storming Russian airport trying to board an Israel bound flight to lynch any Jews. The local Rabbi is considering evacuating his entire community. In another Russian city a mob stormed a hotel going room by room as they heard Jews were staying there. A Jewish community centre was burned down.

A group of Jewish students in the US were locked in a library by staff with 'protestors' banging on the doors and windows, like a ******* zombie movie, screaming 'Free Palestine!'. Took 40 minutes before the Police could reach them.

And lets not get started on what's going on in London. 2 weeks to remembrance day...

[malvolio]

See this is what I genuinely don't get. The God that you (as a Christian) worship is the same (Abrahamic) God that Jewish people and Muslim people worship. Even within flavours of religion there is fighting and hatred - Catholic v Protestant, Sunni v Shiite etc... Surely a loving God isn't insecure enough to really be that fussed if you pray on the wrong day or facing the wrong direction, or via the wrong intermediary? I mean you can't all be right - you presumably believe that the way to heaven is via Jesus - is God really gonna say "feck off" to someone who has lived a good life, trying to honour God, who believes that Mohammed is the right way? Do you really think that if you were born in a different culture, you would have somehow found the 'true' way and rejected the teachings of the society you were born into? You can't all be right? Where is God in all this - has he bitten off more than he can chew? When it was Adam, Eve and a few dozen descendants he was all good, but it's all got a bit out of hand? Or is he just bored with it all?

All those religions aren't arguing about their God, they are arguing about which prophet is the right one and how they should be followed. To the sane mind, how you worship is not all that important as long as you do, but people will insist of fighting over what are trivial differences in interpretation of scripture and nuances of religious protocol. Where it goes badly wrong is when you decide unilaterally that someone else's interpretation is wrong and so they need to be punished, often using some long-outdated medieval legislation.

It is simultaneously sad and utterly pointless, but we are rather stuck with it.

[JustKeepSwimming]

All those religions aren't arguing about their God, they are arguing about which prophet is the right one and how they should be followed. To the sane mind, how you worship is not all that important as long as you do, but people will insist of fighting over what are trivial differences in interpretation of scripture and nuances of religious protocol. Where it goes badly wrong is when you decide unilaterally that someone else's interpretation is wrong and so they need to be punished, often using some long-outdated medieval legislation.

It is simultaneously sad and utterly pointless, but we are rather stuck with it.

The main difference is that Islam is far more rigid than Christianity and Judaism. It allows for zero nuance. The Quran is the literal word of God. Christianity and Judaism both accept that their religious texts were written by men, which means most followers understand there is some degree of wiggle room in interpretation.

When you believe your religious text is literal transcription of the words of God there is no wiggle room. There is no room for interpretation or critical thinking of the meaning behind the 'lessons'. Which is why unlike most other religions Islam has not moderated over the decades.

Christianity, Judaism and Islam mandates death for apostasy. Only one actively carries out the sentence.

[Paddy]

See this is what I genuinely don't get. The God that you (as a Christian) worship is the same (Abrahamic) God that Jewish people and Muslim people worship. Even within flavours of religion there is fighting and hatred - Catholic v Protestant, Sunni v Shiite etc... Surely a loving God isn't insecure enough to really be that fussed if you pray on the wrong day or facing the wrong direction, or via the wrong intermediary? I mean you can't all be right - you presumably believe that the way to heaven is via Jesus - is God really gonna say "feck off" to someone who has lived a good life, trying to honour God, who believes that Mohammed is the right way? Do you really think that if you were born in a different culture, you would have somehow found the 'true' way and rejected the teachings of the society you were born into? You can't all be right? Where is God in all this - has he bitten off more than he can chew? When it was Adam, Eve and a few dozen descendants he was all good, but it's all got a bit out of hand? Or is he just bored with it all?

At least twice I have read the Koran and studied the history. I would argue the following: -
It's not the same God, Muhammad came from a tribe who worshiped the Moon, he then mixed the stories of the Jewish and Christian Gods with his stories.
The Koran is supposed to be the verbatim word of God who only speaks Arabic. However, the Koran contains some Jewish and Armenian words.
The Koran is supposed to contain everything need for life on Earth, however, somethings are utterly stupid such as a its ok to drink water if you push a fly in it because one wing has the antidote to poison.
Every chapter starts with the threat that any unbeliever in the book will burn in Hell for ever, so you better keep reading a believe.
It's OK to lie to non-believers.