I just need to get two references ...

[Can sleep at night]

You'd better don your asbestos suit having admitted your true nature on this forum, but that's life

...but seriously, I think most of us contractors - despite all the verbal attacks on agents - realize deep-down that not all of them are worthy of shooting...probably only the ones that are still breathing.

In my career, I have actually come across a few (very few though) who seemed reasonably genuine and honest people - and I've appreciated that greatly. Sadly, I also don't know any of them who are still agents today, so maybe that says something.

So, welcome to the forum, and congratulations on bucking the trend.

Lol thanks Eddie no asbestos suit needed tho - you need pretty thick skin to stay in the IT rec market for this long.

If clients want to work with me, they do, if they already have other suppliers and don't need my help, then so be it, I don't need to be pushy or get under handed to win the deal, even in a recession there is still plenty of work out there! Mind you it helps that I am my own boss and don't have a manager standing over me cracking the whip!

I am quite used to the flack - was attacked at my previous place of work (many years ago before I set up on my own) for blowing the whistle on some truly dreadful 'sharp' recruitment practise which involved watching the contracts team lying bare faced to the client, using alter egos, tricking a rival agent out of a deal but the real victiom was sadly a very nice contractor who was the right man for the job but lost out because of their lies.

I completely understand why some agencies have such a bad reputation and I make it my mission to never ever sink to the levels of those scumbags...Anyhoo i will get off my soap box now, thanks for the warm welcome

[DodgyAgent]

Lol and how exactly would I prove that?

That's OK I have nothing to prove, I know its true, I don't care if you believe me or not.

Wow what a lovely welcome but exactly what I expected from agents who clearly sees the concept of 99% word of mouth biz as being fantasy. Its easy, treat clients and contractors/candidates well, take your head out your xxxx, work hard, 100% honestly and the rest will follow.

As for the 'if you want to survive on this board' bit ...get over yourself! I don't care if people take the p!ss out of me , it doesn't bother me and just makes you look childish.

Enough people complain about how badly the agencies act and so many agents seem to do what every other agent does simply because they don't have the brains or the balls to make a stand and stop acting like jerks (am being polite here - I am a lady!)

I don't subscribe to the standard agency hand book AKA how to manipulate lie and cheat your way to more money and I don't care if I sound like a goody two shoes or if you believe me or not.

I completely understand why so many contractors (and permies) call agents pimps and are so sceptical. Some of the behaviour I have witnessed in all my years as a recruiter has been disgusting. But change can only come from within and /or if clients stop rewarding bad behaviour - I won't hold my breath on either happenign anytime soon!!

If you are female then I really hope that you have all the bits in the right place, otherwise no one would tolerate your self obsession.

[RichardCranium]

But change can only come from within and /or if clients stop rewarding bad behaviour

True enough. Therein lies a causation.

[RichardCranium]

To be honest I cannot understand the animosity. The argument is between me and DA, not the rest of you.

That's a bit childish.

Either way, I strongly believe that an agent a) has the right to ask for references/checks (which was the point of the original post) and b) should not be criticised/chastised for doing so.

Here we go again. What comes next? "You can trust me, honest."

Sad world we live in. You have clients on here (potentially with the various PMs), agents and contractors/candidates. If we could all connect then we could probably help one another

= "You can trust me, honest."

I, as a contractor, have no problems giving references for my work.

However, I strongly believe that the vast majority of agents do not request references for the stated reason of verifying what I have done in the past. They are in fact in only trying to get these contacts in order to further their business. This is borne out by the many times an agent will ask for references before they even tell me who a role is with, before I can even get an interview, and as soon as you tell them you are happy to give the reference to the end-client, you never hear from them again.

WHS over and over again for 15 years, in my experience.

In my career, I have actually come across a few (very few though) who seemed reasonably genuine and honest people - and I've appreciated that greatly. Sadly, I also don't know any of them who are still agents today, so maybe that says something.

I have known two. In 15 years. Neither appear to be in IT recruitment any more.

[Can sleep at night]

If you are female then I really hope that you have all the bits in the right place, otherwise no one would tolerate your self obsession.

Lol, yup just had a quick check all the bits in the right place, thanks for your concern.

OK so I do have a habit of getting on my soap box when it comes to such matters, but good recruitment practice - incuding not wasting candidates' time by pestering them for unnecessary references - is something I feel passionately about.

I agree that recruiters have the right to ask for references but only as appropriate and when actually required.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

If you are female then I really hope that you have all the bits in the right place, otherwise no one would tolerate your self obsession.

Lovely, where did that piece of divine wisdom come from? "All the bits", classy, DA if all else fails perhaps you can go into human biology with such apt descriptions of the female of the species.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

Lol and how exactly would I prove that?

That's OK I have nothing to prove, I know its true, I don't care if you believe me or not.

Wow what a lovely welcome but exactly what I expected from agents who clearly sees the concept of 99% word of mouth biz as being fantasy. Its easy, treat clients and contractors/candidates well, take your head out your xxxx, work hard, 100% honestly and the rest will follow.

As for the 'if you want to survive on this board' bit ...get over yourself! I don't care if people take the p!ss out of me , it doesn't bother me and just makes you look childish.

Enough people complain about how badly the agencies act and so many agents seem to do what every other agent does simply because they don't have the brains or the balls to make a stand and stop acting like jerks (am being polite here - I am a lady!)

I don't subscribe to the standard agency hand book AKA how to manipulate lie and cheat your way to more money and I don't care if I sound like a goody two shoes or if you believe me or not.

I completely understand why so many contractors (and permies) call agents pimps and are so sceptical. Some of the behaviour I have witnessed in all my years as a recruiter has been disgusting. But change can only come from within and /or if clients stop rewarding bad behaviour - I won't hold my breath on either happenign anytime soon!!

Good Luck on here, I tried to explain everything you have and got shot down, time and time again. Not that it bothers me, but if you try to perservere with your stance on here, nonsense seems to prevail over common sense.

I am guessing we are quite similar, I have been working in the industry for many years, have many established clients, trade on my expertise and reputation (most of my clients are former contractors that have risen through the ranks etc.) . Obvious business approach. However the moment you try to explain this on here, you have to "prove it", not sure how.

I work within Collective Investments and Mutual Funds, Unit Trust and Fund Accounting within Investment Management and I suspect many on here do not walk in those circles so find it hard to understand where I am coming from.

[Punter]

Hello all. Just got this email from an agent. Is this blatant fishing or I am just cynical?

"Good Morning Punter,

My records show I haven't had an updated CV from you in the last 6 months.

I am finding that the market is definitely turning, and the need to have up to date information for fast turn around is as strong as ever.

Please feel free to forward your latest CV, and once I have received it I will touch base to discuss what you have been working on in your most recent assignments.

Regards"

[Hutch]

The old tricks huh

If the job requires references, then I always insist that I will forward them to the interviewing manager once I have had an interview confirmed. The Agency, although they will always say they are pre-vetting on behalf of the client - and bleet on if they dont get them, but of course they are fishing for new leads ... and in these days of fewer jobs available, its a great way to try and get new client contacts ... I simply tell ell the agencies that I can supply references for all definate job offers, but not for each job application .. jobs are always advertised by multiple agents so if they dont like it, just tell em you will find the other agents.

[BrowneIssue]

Hello all. Just got this email from an agent. Is this blatant fishing or I am just cynical?

You're just cynical (which is a good thing). It means your CV hasn't been updated in 6 months and they'd like an up-to-date one for their keyword-searching database. They do this (update their systems) when they have no work to do. If you're not looking, ignore it.