I just need to get two references ...

[d000hg]

To be honest I cannot understand the animosity. The argument is between me and DA, not the rest of you.

1)You're doing it on a public forum, you fool
2)You've publicly brought the community members into your arguments with the whole "18 people called DA a t***" statement, you hypocrite.

I will speak out and I speak as I find, in other words if we were face to face in a pub then I would speak as I type, I believe internet forums should act as such, someone (bless them) earlier stated, hey agents fighting (or similar), not really, its just a point of opinion.

3)It's a forum for contractors. Don't you think you should behave like an invited guest at a party, not the drunk guy who gatecrashes and spills wine all over the new carpet?

[Peoplesoft bloke]

1. There is no legitimate reason to need references prior to an interview. There just isn't, and no amount of weasel words can say there is - and I would say that to you in the pub too. If I miss out on a plum contract because of that thruth - so be it; but I wouldn't want a contract run by twunts who demand a ref prior to interview anyway.

2. I don't come here for work, I come here for information and entertainment and to bait toolheads like CyberGit. I wouldn't mind betting some of us do network outside of here, possibly without even knowing we're on here.

3.You have been pretty nasty to DA - lord knows why I would stick up for him, but if it came to it, based on his postings here, I'd trust him far more to get me a gig than you because he appears at least to have a shred of humanity and a bit of a sense of humour.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

1)You're doing it on a public forum, you fool
2)You've publicly brought the community members into your arguments with the whole "18 people called DA a t***" statement, you hypocrite.


3)It's a forum for contractors. Don't you think you should behave like an invited guest at a party, not the drunk guy who gatecrashes and spills wine all over the new carpet?

Well not really, I am just another forum member, not an invited guest, sorry your analogy does not stand up. Still you keep noshing dOOOhg you will be alright mate.

[jmo21]

Either way, I strongly believe that an agent a) has the right to ask for references/checks (which was the point of the original post) and b) should not be criticised/chastised for doing so.

this is the problem......

I, as a contractor, have no problems giving references for my work.

However, I strongly believe that the vast majority of agents do not request references for the stated reason of verifying what I have done in the past.

They are in fact in only trying to get these contacts in order to further their business.

This is borne out by the many times an agent will ask for references before they even tell me who a role is with, before I can even get an interview, and as soon as you tell them you are happy to give the reference to the end-client, you never hear from them again.

ADA - you may say on here that you are "straight up" and honestly have good intentions with my references. Being an anonymous agent posting on a forum, I have no reason to believe you.

There are agents I have dealt with in the past who haven't asked for references, they've been up front, I've gotten interview's, gotten roles (and lost some too).

But there are many who claim "it's the rules, we have to ask for references" etc and you never hear from them again.

Early in my career, naive as I was, I gave the references, and never heard from the agents again.

so, forgive me if I don't believe your honorable posturings.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

1.

3.You have been pretty nasty to DA - lord knows why I would stick up for him, but if it came to it, based on his postings here, I'd trust him far more to get me a gig than you because he appears at least to have a shred of humanity and a bit of a sense of humour.

Maybe I have but he is tough enough to deal with my comments I am sure, I have seen him tear into a few members in the past, so what comes around goes around.

Question is, has he got you a gig? Offered a gig? Suggested he get you a gig?

So where is the difference???

You want humanity, ok, I am married, have two children, a boy and a girl. My girl is ill with lupus and secondary condition called pulmonary hypertension (I am sure you will look it up), I am told she has 10 years, but I believe and hope that she goes further. I have 42 contractors on site. I have 10 clients that I have built relationships with over the last 12 years, most of whom are ex contractors that have become clients. Most are friends, I have been invited to two of my contractors weddings, have been best man for one and have attended numerous stag nights of my contractors, most are friends and I value our relationships.

My mum has skin cancer, its effecting her legs but is spreading further, she is 75, I don't know what to do to reassure her. My father died two years ago of a massive heart attack, I will be going to his grave on fathers day. My grand daughter is one year old and I am holding a party for her first birthday this Saturday, is that enough humanity for you?

Sense of humour you want also? Ok, two elephants fall off a cliff, BOOM, BOOM!

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Maybe I have but he is tough enough to deal with my comments I am sure, I have seen him tear into a few members in the past, so what comes around goes around.

Question is, has he got you a gig? Offered a gig? Suggested he get you a gig?

So where is the difference??? !

I've never noticed him a) pretending that there's any valid excuse for demanding references prior to interview or b) being as vitriolic as you to another poster - but I may have missed some of it.

Aside from that not much difference, I guess.

You want humanity, ok, I am married, have two children, a boy and a girl. My girl is ill with lupus and secondary condition called pulmonary hypertension (I am sure you will look it up), I am told she has 10 years, but I believe and hope that she goes further. I have 42 contractors on site. I have 10 clients that I have built relationships with over the last 12 years, most of whom are ex contractors that have become clients. Most are friends, I have been invited to two of my contractors weddings, have been best man for one and have attended numerous stag nights of my contractors, most are friends and I value our relationships.

My mum has skin cancer, its effecting[sic] her legs but is spreading further, she is 75, I don't know what to do to reassure her. My father died two years ago of a massive heart attack, I will be going to his grave on fathers day. My grand daughter is one year old and I am holding a party for her first birthday this Saturday, is that enough humanity for you?

Sense of humour you want also? Ok, two elephants fall off a cliff, BOOM, BOOM!

The stuff about the weddings would have done - if you want to get into what the septics call a p1ssin1g contest about dead Dads and ill relatives, I might win, but I've never felt a need to mention that stuff on here and I see no reason to start now - what are you trying to prove? What I meant was that DA ....oh never mind - I am honestly not trying to fall out with you - just thought you were overstating the case a bit.

[d000hg]

Noshing? Sorry I don't get the meaning...

[Another Dodgy Agent]

I've never noticed him a) pretending that there's any valid excuse for demanding references prior to interview or b) being as vitriolic as you to another poster - but I may have missed some of it.

Aside from that not much difference, I guess.



The stuff about the weddings would have done - if you want to get into what the septics call a p1ssin1g contest about dead Dads and ill relatives, I might win, but I've never felt a need to mention that stuff on here and I see no reason to start now - what are you trying to prove? What I meant was that DA ....oh never mind - I am honestly not trying to fall out with you - just thought you were overstating the case a bit.

Just trying to demonstrate that I am "real" have real problems and therefore demonstrate "humanity".

I am trying to prove that I come on here with a real world approach, probably wasting my time.

Not overstating the case I am afraid, just how it is, cheers for the understanding.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

Noshing? Sorry I don't get the meaning...

Well that is probably a good thing, take care, have a good night, sweet dreams and I hope you have a fantastic day tomorrow.

[Another Dodgy Agent]

this is the problem......

I, as a contractor, have no problems giving references for my work.

Good!

However, I strongly believe that the vast majority of agents do not request references for the stated reason of verifying what I have done in the past.

They are in fact in only trying to get these contacts in order to further their business.

And the problem is? How do you think agencies get clients???

This is borne out by the many times an agent will ask for references before they even tell me who a role is with, before I can even get an interview, and as soon as you tell them you are happy to give the reference to the end-client, you never hear from them again.

Because you are (as an indidvidual) too much hassle. The client will NOT ask for references prior to an offer, however as a recruitment consultant I would look to have references in place prior to submitting your CV for two reasons: a) I can submit your references with your CV, creditability to my client will be fantastic, look they have references for this candiate already, how many other agencies have submitted referenced candidates?

b) I don't know you are capable of that which you put in your CV, nothing worse (and boy does it happen) where you submit a non referenced candidate, who subsequently cannot deliver and we have not referenced because they refuse to provide references, no surprise there then.

ADA - you may say on here that you are "straight up" and honestly have good intentions with my references. Being an anonymous agent posting on a forum, I have no reason to believe you.

Likewise I have no reason to trust you either.

There are agents I have dealt with in the past who haven't asked for references, they've been up front, I've gotten interview's, gotten roles (and lost some too).

That's fine but imagine you are the client for the moment. Would you not want a reference check taken out on a candidate submitted to you?

But there are many who claim "it's the rules, we have to ask for references" etc and you never hear from them again.

Early in my career, naive as I was, I gave the references, and never heard from the agents again.

so, forgive me if I don't believe your honorable posturings.

No problem, you have every reason to be sceptical, however I hope I have demonstated above why they are necessary and not everyone is out to get your referee's!