State of the Market

[DrewG]

Seen the current market - good luck not meeting your clients expectations..

An incredible oversimplification.

If you've been around for any amount of time, you should have made yourself somewhat anti-fragile so you don't have to bend over backwards at the whim of pointy haired managers.

I meet my contractual obligations, no more, no less.

[northernladuk]

If you're paid via a hourly/daily rate, rather than via an SoW/deliverables, it sounds like they're treating you like staff, and you're letting them.

Utter rubbish. Name me a supplier that's come on a clients site and hasn't stepped up when there are problems. Delivering a good quality service to a client even when it's going tits up has absolutely **** all to do with being treated like staff and letting them. What should a supplier do when the client is in the crap? Work to rule and walk off when the clock hits 5? Poppycock (within reason of course). Converse to your argument if I have a SoW and deliverables and something in the project is making it difficult to hit those deliverables you put the time in to hit them, something a permie wouldn't do.

And to the other detractors. I earn over 100k a year from my client, market is tulipe, I want more business from my client and I certainly don't want to be treated like the dick of the project because I'm working to rule when times are tough. So I put some extra time in when it's needed. I agree, it has to be balanced and there has to be something in it for me. Most clients, granted not all, will recognise the work and will reciprocate in some form. Billing when not working, more work, afternoons on the golf course while working. All can be negotiated if the work you do is recognised. Worked well for me on a number of gigs.

But if you want to do the bare minimum and struggle through then be my guest.

Caveat, this is time is well managed and must be reciprocated. I agree just doing it like a drone for absolutely no benefit is not smart.. but there can be good benefits to be found if you manage it properly.

[Paralytic]

Utter rubbish. Name me a supplier that's come on a clients site and hasn't stepped up when there are problems.

Er, any consultancy I've ever seen that charges per hour/day will charge extra if they're asked to work extra.

[rocktronAMP]

An incredible oversimplification.

If you've been around for any amount of time, you should have made yourself somewhat anti-fragile so you don't have to bend over backwards at the whim of pointy haired managers.

I meet my contractual obligations, no more, no less.

So why are you then working for the pointy haird manager (a la Dilbert and co comics) in the first placce? I wouldn't after my experience. I should've left previoius consultancy in September after a nice GOV.UK assignment finished. The client GOV.UK director gave us, the team, a great commendation. My consultancy did not care about it so much. When it came to my review the consultancy said, "This is NOT an individual commendment to YOU". I thought WHAT THE ****? and also **** YOU! I guess Kalvin Phililips of Manchester City Football Club does not deserve a Premier League medal for his contribution to the season 2022/2023. Much to my chagrin, I should've have known that "Never Trust, Completely" (the maxim) is the rule not the exception. When my next assignment went pear, south and down. "You are as good as your last game", then I got the boot in February. I spent that time until very recently looking for either contract or perm work. Thankfully, I am about to start somewhere new.

Meeting your contractual obligation is not it at all. It is about making yourself INDISPENSIBLE in the eye of the ultimate paying stakeholder. (Do they find you beautiful? yes or no. Simple.) If I am not doing that myself, making my indispensible, in whatever roile, in the future, because of pride, belief, or they the management are not believing in my services, not giving me enough feedback, then it is time to move on. I will not live and work with corporate toxicity anymore. If I ever see, smell, taste toxicity for the rest of my life, then that will be the early klaxon call. This lesson learnt is harshly by me in 2022/2023.

For contractors this is really difficult at the mo... because of the state of market, state of the world, but I can assure you the same goes for the permanent world too. Life is too short. Unfortunately, the count of nice friendly companies to work for and also offering gigs (whether contract or perm) right now is also shrinking for the time being. For many of us, GROUPTHINK and PRESENTEEISM are going to be hard to resist especially those of us in increasing debt situation, borrowing on credit cards, loans, cost of living, sudden mortgage increase shock, rent increase, section 21 notice, sudden redundnacy and restructuring etc. etc. It is rough out there and here. It is going to get rougher. Best DrewG.

[SussexSeagull]

Speaking as someone who is a month into a well paid (by my standards) contract after six months out, I am quite keen to do it for as long as possible. This will involve, most weeks, a once a week visit to the office involving a six hour round trip and staying up there nearer release time.

I had to gently deal with a Test Manager who didn’t appreciate I don’t live round the corner and can’t just pop in the office in the first couple of weeks.

It’s called managing client expectations while being mindful of IR35 implications and not selling your soul.

Always amazes me that contractors can’t do that.

[northernladuk]

Er, any consultancy I've ever seen that charges per hour/day will charge extra if they're asked to work extra.

Yet here I am sat on site with three suppliers that have attended at no extra cost to do some in depth hands on analysis of the problems we are facing which will continue beyond the working day due to the shift patterns.

I don't doubt some consultancies will do that but to be ignorant to the fact many consultancies will do more is naive at best.

But anyway, I do what I do, I earn well and am happy with it so who cares.

Always amazes me that contractors can’t do that.

Same.

[eek]

Yet here I am sat on site with three suppliers that have attended at no extra cost to do some in depth hands on analysis of the problems we are facing which will continue beyond the working day due to the shift patterns.

+1 - consultancies will often work extra hours for free because if they don't do it they know that a new consultancy will be brought in to take over their projects.

At clientco we are having great fun discussing certain freebie (licences) we would get if we brought in a different consultancy for a particular piece of work - result is the current consultancy is rapidly working out how to implement that freebie for us at no obvious costs to ourselves (because we aren't paying for the 3 people developing it).

[Bluenose]

Exactly, the law doesn't look at the design of timesheet systems and work backwards; it's a catch all for all kinds of work arrangements.

You'll struggle to find a single case of "timesheet fraud" on record; it only exists in permietractors heads (who work 2 year long contracts, working extra hours, and thank their masser when they're not culled).

Sorry mods for going O/T.

The point re: Timesheet fraud, was not the law being broken, it probably is being broken in these cases but it's moot. The point is one of professional ethics. That elusive word that's hard to say and even harder to apply to one's daily life especially if, you are starving.

Anyway, in a token offering to get the thread back on-topic before it gets locked for a second time.

Not a single phone call this week, again (alas the week is young).

[Bluenose]

When my next assignment went pear, south and down. "You are as good as your last game", then I got the boot in February. I spent that time until very recently looking for either contract or perm work. Thankfully, I am about to start somewhere new.

That's brutal mate and yes, "You are as good as your last game" has never been more correct about senior manager attitudes towards your work.

It is about making yourself INDISPENSIBLE in the eye of the ultimate paying stakeholder. (Do they find you beautiful? yes or no. Simple.) If I am not doing that myself, making my indispensible, in whatever roile, in the future, because of pride, belief, or they the management are not believing in my services, not giving me enough feedback, then it is time to move on. I will not live and work with corporate toxicity anymore. If I ever see, smell, taste toxicity for the rest of my life, then that will be the early klaxon call

(Rocket from Guardians Of The Galaxy voice) Also TRUE.

[DrewG]

So why are you then working for the pointy haird manager (a la Dilbert and co comics) in the first placce? I wouldn't after my experience. I should've left previoius consultancy in September after a nice GOV.UK assignment finished. The client GOV.UK director gave us, the team, a great commendation. My consultancy did not care about it so much. When it came to my review the consultancy said, "This is NOT an individual commendment to YOU". I thought WHAT THE ****? and also **** YOU! I guess Kalvin Phililips of Manchester City Football Club does not deserve a Premier League medal for his contribution to the season 2022/2023. Much to my chagrin, I should've have known that "Never Trust, Completely" (the maxim) is the rule not the exception. When my next assignment went pear, south and down. "You are as good as your last game", then I got the boot in February. I spent that time until very recently looking for either contract or perm work. Thankfully, I am about to start somewhere new.

Meeting your contractual obligation is not it at all. It is about making yourself INDISPENSIBLE in the eye of the ultimate paying stakeholder. (Do they find you beautiful? yes or no. Simple.) If I am not doing that myself, making my indispensible, in whatever roile, in the future, because of pride, belief, or they the management are not believing in my services, not giving me enough feedback, then it is time to move on. I will not live and work with corporate toxicity anymore. If I ever see, smell, taste toxicity for the rest of my life, then that will be the early klaxon call. This lesson learnt is harshly by me in 2022/2023.

For contractors this is really difficult at the mo... because of the state of market, state of the world, but I can assure you the same goes for the permanent world too. Life is too short. Unfortunately, the count of nice friendly companies to work for and also offering gigs (whether contract or perm) right now is also shrinking for the time being. For many of us, GROUPTHINK and PRESENTEEISM are going to be hard to resist especially those of us in increasing debt situation, borrowing on credit cards, loans, cost of living, sudden mortgage increase shock, rent increase, section 21 notice, sudden redundnacy and restructuring etc. etc. It is rough out there and here. It is going to get rougher. Best DrewG.

Do you drop this level of incoherence onto your clients?