Greenism in it's death throes

[EternalOptimist]

and the lion will lay down with the lamb

amen

[shaunbhoy]

and the lion will lay down with the lamb

amen

....and at this time, a friend shall lose a friend's hammer...........

[OwlHoot]

Solar is a "fad" even George Monbiot thinks solar in a country where it's cloudy most of the time is nonsense. ..

George Monbiot's support for nuclear, sound though that is, seems to blind him to any other possibilities.

If solar can be made a bit more efficient and cheaper, which it may very well be over the next few years, it will make a significant contribution, especially in outlying areas such as villages (where there's more room for panels anyway).

I wonder how these guys are getting on with their project to make artificial chloroplasts. An efficient, practical solution to that would be a fantastic advance.

[d000hg]

Solar is a "fad" even George Monbiot thinks solar in a country where it's cloudy most of the time is nonsense.

I'm aware of no hard physics-based limitation that means you can't create a solar panel of 50%+ efficiency which will last for several decades. Regardless of cloudiness if such panels could also be made cheap enough that they are used instead of roof tiles, it's of worth. This is of course looking a long way past where we are now or even likely to be, it's a theoretical exercise. Solar in sunny climes and a way to transport the harvested energy seems preferable... international grid or something.

Wind power will also fail, wind farms are follies that contribute virtually nothing.

Just wait until the 1000foot models come in in 2050

[BlasterBates]

In 2011, the United Kingdom had installed 77.8 MWp of photovoltaic capacity, three times as much as in the previous year, but still only representing 0.1% of total electricity production.

Solar power in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Solar currently contributes 0.1%, of course that will grow. I imagine it'll max out at around 1%. That's the point where politicians will notice the subsidies are too massive.

[MarillionFan]

Cracking good link this Solar PV Feed In Tariff Calculator

Images of how much space on your roof is used up per kwh, the estimated cost to install based on size,
the region of the country you are in and so an estimate of solar irradiation, tilt etc, feedback tariffs etc.

Normally coming back at 11-12 years to get your money back. So it will pay for itself in 11-12 years. If you'd put the money in the bank to earn interest then it actually takes about 25 years to get a return. They are estimated on a life of 30 years.

So as EO says, not worth it, especially if the feedback tariff is cut as it will be over time.

Think I might just turn the lights off when I go to bed instead.

[OwlHoot]

So as EO says, not worth it, especially if the feedback tariff is cut as it will be over time.

..

What EO seems to forget is that when the carrot is no longer there, the stick might come into play - penalties and surcharges for "inefficient" dwellings etc.

[BlasterBates]

There is of course the CO2 emissions caused by manufacturing solar cells

Low-tech Magazine: The ugly side of solar panels

The question is, is whether in dull cloudy climate in the UK the Solar cells emit less CO2 than burning gas. Doesn't seem to be much in it.

...and what about this gas

http://e360.yale.edu/content/feature.msp?id=2085

The more one investigates the pros and cons of renewables the clearer it is that it is driven by dogma rather than scientific sense.

[EternalOptimist]

What EO seems to forget is that when the carrot is no longer there, the stick might come into play - penalties and surcharges for "inefficient" dwellings etc.

You are right. I haven't even thought about what the green nazis next move will be

Dont forget the Germans went down the solar panel route about ten years before we did. They are at a similar latitude and have a similar energy economy to us. They have about a quarter of a million rooftop installations , producing 0.5% of german lekky, and they pulled the subsidy just over a year ago.
The reason for pulling the plug ? It was seen to have become an enormous folly. They saved zero carbon, and the lekky was horrendously expensive.

[TykeMerc]

Despite being deeply sceptical about AGW, I'd love there to be good, reliable, effective, cheap and efficient renewable generation, however at the moment that appears to be a pipe dream.