Doom: Energy Price Cap

[WTFH]

https://www.energydashboard.co.uk/live

[BlasterBates]

https://www.energydashboard.co.uk/live

That's interesting so EVs are effectively 50% powered by natural gas.

[SueEllen]

That's interesting so EVs are effectively 50% powered by natural gas.

Depends on the time of day, day of week and season.

I had a look over the weekend and there were hours were most of the electricity was generated from renewables and nuclear. It is when peaks are hit in summer we need more gas as some renewables e.g. wind turbines are more efficient in winter.

[d000hg]

Most charge EVs at night when less is in use so it's probably more green-skewed but the point is with EVs, every time you improve the grid, all your cars get greener.

I wonder if burning gas at scale is more or less efficient/dirty than burning petrol in your car. What losses do you get transporting electricity from the power station to your car, for example?

[vetran]

Most charge EVs at night when less is in use so it's probably more green-skewed but the point is with EVs, every time you improve the grid, all your cars get greener.

I wonder if burning gas at scale is more or less efficient/dirty than burning petrol in your car. What losses do you get transporting electricity from the power station to your car, for example?

it depends

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator...S?locations=GB

but 8% is normal

https://data.worldbank.org/indicator...&start=2014&vi ew=map

Best would be to ramp up the base level of slow to start but greenish generation (Nuclear takes about 12 hours to come online fully) and remove the green generation peaks

https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=45956

Then use the excess for hydrogen production or other storage, load shedding car charging or storage heating if needed (intelligent charging points) but of course we didn't implement either.

https://www.spglobal.com/marketintel...-race-65162028

and the car charger is 70-90% efficient so worst case ~60%

https://spectrum.ieee.org/how-effici...ts-complicated

Wind blows at night and Air/hydrogen storage would make generation renewable and with Hydrogen generate enough gas to drive fleets.

The trick is not to burn any fossil fuels.

[dsc]

I wonder if burning gas at scale is more or less efficient/dirty than burning petrol in your car.

It's more efficient and less dirty, but EVs come with their own share of problems (batteries need manufacturing from something and cost of those cars is currently astronomical).

[DealorNoDeal]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business...-bills-tax-gas

"Energy bills for UK households will be frozen at or below the current price cap under a £130bn plan drawn up by Liz Truss."

"That’s likely to be at or below the current price cap of £1,971."

[Whorty]

It's more efficient and less dirty, but EVs come with their own share of problems (batteries need manufacturing from something and cost of those cars is currently astronomical).

My personal view, and not based on strong science or research, just my view, is that EVs are a white elephant.

It's the battery thing for me that will be the killer of EV. We're fine for now with the small number of western cars being produced, but I'd be surprised there are enough resources to source the material for a world's worth of EV cars, and keep them on the road. Unless we're happy destroying the environment of the countries where the core material comes from ... and then then is the land fill issue after wards when the batteries are no long in use.

No idea what the answer is, but long term it doesn't feel like EV.

Hydrogen? If we can stop cars from acting like a mobile bomb!

[vetran]

My personal view, and not based on string science or research, just my view, is that EVs are a white elephant.

It's the battery thing for me that will be the killer of EV. We're fine for now with the small number of western cars being produced, but I'd be surprised there are enough resources to source the material for a world's worth of EV cars, and keep them on the road. Unless we're happy destroying the environment of the countries where the core material comes from ... and then then is the land fill issue after wards when the batteries are no long in use.

No idea what the answer is, but long term it doesn't feel like EV.

Hydrogen? If we can stop cars from acting like a mobile bomb!

damn agreeing with warty again!

[Paddy]

My personal view, and not based on string science or research, just my view, is that EVs are a white elephant.

It's the battery thing for me that will be the killer of EV. We're fine for now with the small number of western cars being produced, but I'd be surprised there are enough resources to source the material for a world's worth of EV cars, and keep them on the road. Unless we're happy destroying the environment of the countries where the core material comes from ... and then then is the land fill issue after wards when the batteries are no long in use.

No idea what the answer is, but long term it doesn't feel like EV.

Hydrogen? If we can stop cars from acting like a mobile bomb!

There are not enough raw materials in the world to manufacture the batteries nor to produce the electric motors let alone supply the electricity plus there is also the short lifespan of the car itself. Hydrogen fuel cells are doable but not for all vehicles. What is needed instead is good public transport, good international railways, less flying and a ban on those f'ing cruise ship monstrosities.