Trevor Phillips talking sense as usual

[d000hg]

It's really very simple. No civilisation in history has been built without using slave labour in some form or another.

People need to stop rewriting the past on the back of a very incomplete education and a limited knowledge of history, and look at where slavery still exists today. That might at least be of some practical benefit.

But that might be too difficult for their tiny minds, and they wouldn't get to parade around pretending to have the answers.

Rewriting and "not celebrating" certain aspects of history are quite different though. If there was a statue of Jimmy Savile somewhere when his true past was exposed, is it 'rewriting' history to remove it?

Some things are very simple, but that doesn't mean what you do about it is.

PS: no I'm not advocating we tear down all the statues, especially not by mob-decision

[NigelJK]

Rewriting and "not celebrating" certain aspects of history are quite different though. If there was a statue of Jimmy Savile somewhere when his true past was exposed, is it 'rewriting' history to remove it?

I believe there was one at Stoke Mandeville, which has been removed. Not sure if Garry Glitter ever achieve such status.

[Gibbon]

look at where slavery still exists today. That might at least be of some practical benefit.

But that might be too difficult for their tiny minds, and they wouldn't get to parade around pretending to have the answers.

This with bells on! Also a bit more how Britain Unilaterally decided to abolish slavery and then policed the seven seas preventing others.

[vetran]

Rewriting and "not celebrating" certain aspects of history are quite different though. If there was a statue of Jimmy Savile somewhere when his true past was exposed, is it 'rewriting' history to remove it?

Some things are very simple, but that doesn't mean what you do about it is.

PS: no I'm not advocating we tear down all the statues, especially not by mob-decision

Indeed what Trevor Phillips is saying is that it needs to be done with thought & planning not mob rule.

If the local council decides after careful consideration Jimmy Savile's statue needs to come down then I am perfectly fine with that.

Though maybe we should pull down statues of convicted terrorists like Nelson Mandela?

What about Bomber Harris or anyone who legally traded in slaves?

[WTFH]

This with bells on! Also a bit more how Britain Unilaterally decided to abolish slavery and then policed the seven seas preventing others.

Unfortunately if the country learned more about Wilberforce & Wedgewood, they'd be offended by the campaign figure of a slave kneeling.

[malvolio]

Unfortunately if the country learned more about Wilberforce & Wedgewood, they'd be offended by the campaign figure of a slave kneeling.

Yep, totally agreed. Some people are too dangerous to be allowed to think...

[d000hg]

Indeed what Trevor Phillips is saying is that it needs to be done with thought & planning not mob rule.

If the local council decides after careful consideration Jimmy Savile's statue needs to come down then I am perfectly fine with that.

While I agree, there IS a time and place for spontaneity. Many of the big (positive) changes came about, or were sparked not by committees giving careful consideration but some flashpoint when a person or some people just decided it was time to act.

For instance those iconic images of Saddam's statue being toppled.

Even when towns do thoughtfully consider and come to a decision e.g. "let's rename our school or sport stadium" they still get accused of "pandering to the woke". If a population want to ditch some past figure as an icon, surely that's their choice.

[malvolio]

While I agree, there IS a time and place for spontaneity. Many of the big (positive) changes came about, or were sparked not by committees giving careful consideration but some flashpoint when a person or some people just decided it was time to act.

For instance those iconic images of Saddam's statue being toppled.

Even when towns do thoughtfully consider and come to a decision e.g. "let's rename our school or sport stadium" they still get accused of "pandering to the woke". If a population want to ditch some past figure as an icon, surely that's their choice.

But it is very rarely a population. Nearly the whole of Iraq wanted Saddam gone. About 100 idiot students wanted the Colston statue gone, ignoring inter alia that without him there wouldn't have been a a lot of schools and charitable institutions in Bristol and most Bristolians thought of him (if they thought of him at all) as a major benefactor to the city. Renaming Colston Hall was not necessary nor popular and has been ignored by most locals anyway.

Don't confuse mob rule, or mob hysteria, with majority support.

[Whorty]

Nice to see the 'like minded' having a friendly agreeable chat in this one thread.

[d000hg]

But it is very rarely a population. Nearly the whole of Iraq wanted Saddam gone. About 100 idiot students wanted the Colston statue gone, ignoring inter alia that without him there wouldn't have been a a lot of schools and charitable institutions in Bristol and most Bristolians thought of him (if they thought of him at all) as a major benefactor to the city. Renaming Colston Hall was not necessary nor popular and has been ignored by most locals anyway.

Don't confuse mob rule, or mob hysteria, with majority support.

Where do you get the data that only 100 people supported removing the statue, and most Bristolians thought he was a major benefactor?