So thickos support Brexit and the more intelligent support staying in

[Pondlife]

Making vast sums of money out of nothing seems rather good to me, rather than relying on a limited natural resource. How much money do you think the music industry is worth?

U2 have structured their affairs so that they pay tax in the Netherlands. No reason why rest of the big earners can't do likewise.

[sasguru]

Think it through Sas.

We Exit the EU. Cameron gets toppled. Boris takes over in short term and kicks off UK Wide Boris Bikes scheme. Scotland vote out in referendum. Boris builds a border.

Scotland economy collapses and Sturgeon outlaws fatty foods. PCP collapses and we sell all of our cars back to the French and Germans moving to pedal power. The UK citizens become fit and trim, saving the NHS millions
And allowing us to become self sufficient. Sweaty jocks crave deep fried food and tunnel under the border, where Sir Chris Hoy styled Northeners ferry deep fried Mars Bars across the border. Boris taxes said trade. All the cars in Europe get repossessed as PCP collapses EU wide, and then we takeover Europe on our new army of cyclists and navy of dingy owners.

Win win.

Well that at least posits some scenarios however unlikely.
I veer towards staying in but am willing to be persuaded otherwise. But at the moment, neither side are making any logical or analytical arguments.
I try to put myself in, say, a Chinese company's shoes making an investment in Europe. Why would you invest in the Uk rather than than the EU with its much larger markets?
It's all very well saying we'll trade outside Europe but reality is we're the supplicants in that trade not being a very large market

[BrilloPad]

U2 have structured their affairs so that they pay tax in the Netherlands. No reason why rest of the big earners can't do likewise.

If the tax system worked properly it would be impossible.

But at the moment, neither side are making any logical or analytical arguments.

Very true

I try to put myself in, say, a Chinese company's shoes making an investment in Europe. Why would you invest in the Uk rather than than the EU with its much larger markets? It's all very well saying we'll trade outside Europe but reality is we're the supplicants in that trade not being a very large market

Because in the UK we speak American.

However I would rather focus on what small/medium companies in the UK need. And that is to be out of the EU.

Its all pointless anyway. If we vote out, the EU will give us a better deal and another vote.

[d000hg]

Maybe there are just too many variables and lack of precedent to MAKE a decent analytical argument. Or rather, you can make fact-based arguments to support whatever answer you want.

I'm not even sure this decision should be made based on economics, it's about feeling and emotion. People don't work logically.

[darmstadt]

And where exactly have these conversations been about the Empire and UKIP manifesto??

General but as you've already confessed to being a thicko (which I don't actually believe for a minute) then the search function might be a tad difficult

[woohoo]

General but as you've already confessed to being a thicko (which I don't actually believe for a minute) then the search function might be a tad difficult

I can only think of one person that has talked to me about the empire and that was an Indian colleague and he was being quite positive about British rule. I couldn't give a tulip about the empire along with most people I would guess or at least the ones I mix with.

[seanraaron]

I have a deep distrust of people and power which especially includes big business. I challenge any of you to think of anyone that you would seriously trust to make decisions about your lives that are in positions of power. I doubt there are any.

And yet if this medium-sized country leaves the EU it will be totally at the mercy of big business and outside agencies beyond its control to stay afloat. Newsflash, most of the private sector jobs here are not working for domestic companies. And if you think Britain will get EEA membership without adopting EU regulations, you're insane.

The EU may have problems, but Britain isn't a significant player without it. Consider that the markets in the USA and China are both worth more than the entire EU and yet you expect me to believe a country with less than 1/10 the population is going to be important enough to rate a special trade deal? With whom, Russia?

[woohoo]

Big economy? Most people don't realise how it's done with smoke and mirrors. Britain is one of the most indebted countries in the world, that is how the illusion if wealth is sustained.
To take one example, 80 percent of new cars are "bought" with PCP giving the illusion that the British car market is bigger than those on the continent.

Anyway my initial thought stands: how on earth are the large underclass to make a living if inward investment falls, as I'm sure it must after Brexit?

The whole thing is based on smoke and mirrors and buying into the illusion that the paper in your hand is worth something. I don't understand your example of PCP, if you lease it and then buy it you own it. If you lease it and don't buy it then it's sold on in the second hand market, it's still bought.

[woohoo]

And yet if this medium-sized country leaves the EU it will be totally at the mercy of big business and outside agencies beyond its control to stay afloat. Newsflash, most of the private sector jobs here are not working for domestic companies. And if you think Britain will get EEA membership without adopting EU regulations, you're insane.

The EU may have problems, but Britain isn't a significant player without it. Consider that the markets in the USA and China are both worth more than the entire EU and yet you expect me to believe a country with less than 1/10 the population is going to be important enough to rate a special trade deal? With whom, Russia?

I thought that USA had a number of free trade deals with several countries that would be considered medium to small sized economies.

[sasguru]

Will the Uk really get a special trade deal? In whose interests, apart from us, would that be? Maybe some German car companies.
But overall it's not in the EU interest to encourage an exit in case it sets a precedent. I would think they would stick to their guns and enforce the old rules in return for trading.
So we get to keep the rules but without a say?