State of the Market

[uk contractor]

There was a review into the amount of IT visas but no idea if it progressed.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-b1175334.html

They need to cancel all foreign IT workers Vistas wait a few years see if any fake perceived skills gaps appear train UK born workers to plug those but its not going to happen due to the immense corruption in the government!!

[avonleigh]

They need to cancel all foreign IT workers Vistas wait a few years see if any fake perceived skills gaps appear train UK born workers to plug those but its not going to happen due to the immense corruption in the government!!

Exactly this. Visa's won't stop by any government. As they have their own agenda or are taking backhanders from a lot of these consultancies. I was thinking about how long this has been going on. I remember back in 2010 we had some furniture built at home and the guy doing it was an ex-developer. Said he got made redundant because all dev got offshored and he had had enough. That was 15 years ago. It probably was going on before that but that's the earliest example I can remember.

[jamesbrown]

Can't they pass it onto the contractor?

No, it is paid by the Fee Payer, but any sane client would only operate via an umbrella, so it would be umbrella employment (where IR35 is moot). It's no different than regular employment in that regard. Obviously, the rate negotiated by the contractor reflects the power (im)balance that exists, and you can argue that ErNI is a tax on workers, but that is a separate argument.

[SussexSeagull]

I am all for not giving out anymore IT Visas, or at least heavily restricting them, but you can’t really start throwing out people who came here legally.

For one thing a lot have gone on to get indefinite leave to remain and will have ties here including kids in school.

[uk contractor]

I am all for not giving out anymore IT Visas, or at least heavily restricting them, but you can’t really start throwing out people who came here legally.

For one thing a lot have gone on to get indefinite leave to remain and will have ties here including kids in school.

I think you can do this & you have to do this they will have to seek alternate employment like many of us have or had to its a tough old life! That's what they do in many other countries when your no longer required you have to go!

We are effectively subsidising a high standard of living for millions of people at our own vast expense! Whilst throwing on the trash heap our own people!

[uk contractor]

Exactly this. Visa's won't stop by any government. As they have their own agenda or are taking backhanders from a lot of these consultancies. I was thinking about how long this has been going on. I remember back in 2010 we had some furniture built at home and the guy doing it was an ex-developer. Said he got made redundant because all dev got offshored and he had had enough. That was 15 years ago. It probably was going on before that but that's the earliest example I can remember.

Its been going on since about then but accelerated rapidly last few years as companies look to boost their share price by reducing costs (in the wrong areas!!).

All the IB's are doing it right now that's tens of thousands of highly skilled IT workers many will never work in IT again as the roles are simply no longer there (for decent wages) as the unlimited pool from the outsourcers is all the companies want to lower costs & boost their balance sheet...but when the crash comes it will be seriously ugly financially!!

[ResistanceFighter]

for dev work, I'm starting to see a few more roles pop up (that actually look real) but its very hard to get noticed or reach out to the recruiter. No calls for over a month. Even if there is an improvement, its still going to take some time to churn through all the devs currently on the bench. Emphasis on the word "if"

[SchumiStars]

I started with ICL (Fujitsu services) in 2000. As a fresh grad, I was on high starter salary due to the .dot boom.

There were contractors there for 3/4yrs on £100ph + vat + overtime. Getting them to go home was a challenge.

Not sure, if I have or will see that rate again now. Certainly not, by the time I want to retire in a couple of years anyhow.

No idea why you would want to do computer science at uni, if you can't cover the amount you have to pay back on your degree.

[edison]

I started with ICL (Fujitsu services) in 2000. As a fresh grad, I was on high starter salary due to the .dot boom.

There were contractors there for 3/4yrs on £100ph + vat + overtime. Getting them to go home was a challenge.

Not sure, if I have or will see that rate again now. Certainly not, by the time I want to retire in a couple of years anyhow.

No idea why you would want to do computer science at uni, if you can't cover the amount you have to pay back on your degree.

Saw an interesting post today with a graph showing software engineer job ads on Indeed in the USA has fallen 70% since since 2022.

The poster argued the highly paid developer jobs are now largely the preserve of engineers mainly working on frontier tech.

Many degrees now have limited value in the absence of any work experience when young people enter the job market, computer science is no exception.

Interestingly, CompSci is one of the hardest degrees to get into at the very best UK unis.

[SchumiStars]

Saw an interesting post today with a graph showing software engineer job ads on Indeed in the USA has fallen 70% since since 2022.

The poster argued the highly paid developer jobs are now largely the preserve of engineers mainly working on frontier tech.

Many degrees now have limited value in the absence of any work experience when young people enter the job market, computer science is no exception.

Interestingly, CompSci is one of the hardest degrees to get into at the very best UK unis.

Yes it is. And if you are going to make it hard then
why not apply to the best college, in the best uni, in the country?

I do know a grad from last year in computer science who has not secured any kind of role. A bit demoralising I can imagine.