Reply to: Gaza blockaded

[BlueSharp]

The police did turn up in riot gear and try to block their path. They did not do that with hamas side. Even when the hamas side deviated from their route yesterday and stormed down whitehall all you could see is standard officers sprinting to surround the cenotaph, no riot police anywhere.

You can't use force against one and not the other and then claim any push back against that force is proof that the force was justified.

it seems to me that the Police are scared off the larger hamas protests and refusing to police them normally for fear of violence.

With the far right side, due to their smaller number, they seem happy to crack down on them especially hard.

Exactly this. It was a breakaway group, where was the riot police, and even the Met have said they were unprepared on Twitter. (https://twitter.com/metpoliceuk/stat...33634413441325).

hey were quick enough to remove JSO oil protesters the last few days as well.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/lond...-b1120170.html


IMO, there is a culture of fear in the police of being labelled Islamophobic and it's showing in their policing of these events.

This is how they policed student tuition fees protests a few years back. Not even a mention of hate crime here but many more arrests for disorder we see everytime there is a 'Free Gaza' march.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-war-dead.html
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-11877034

or a Green peace protest:

https://www.theguardian.com/environm...lution-protest

[JustKeepSwimming]

Pay respects? Even the far right media know better than that

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ed-police.html
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/247522...-anti-semites/

The police did turn up in riot gear and try to block their path. They did not do that with hamas side. Even when the hamas side deviated from their route yesterday and stormed down whitehall all you could see is standard officers sprinting to surround the cenotaph, no riot police anywhere.

You can't use force against one and not the other and then claim any push back against that force is proof that the force was justified.

it seems to me that the Police are scared off the larger hamas protests and refusing to police them normally for fear of violence.

With the far right side, due to their smaller number, they seem happy to crack down on them especially hard.

[WTFH]

Want to be a white male and pay respects at a war memorial at the weekend? No can't do that, how about getting kettled and hit with a baton instead?

Pay respects? Even the far right media know better than that

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ed-police.html
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/247522...-anti-semites/

[BlueSharp]

Could someone kindly explain to me why saying **** in public is a crime routinely enforced but climbing over a war memorial to raise a foreign flag isn't? I can't be the only one who thinks the latter is far more prone to disturb the peace than the first.

Police claiming there is no "specific" law that allowed them to make an arrest... outraging public decency seems to fit nicely to me.

The police are making it up as they go along. Want to jump on a war memorial and wave a flag while dressed as a terrorist? Sure go ahead.

Want to be a white male and pay respects at a war memorial at the weekend? No can't do that, how about getting kettled and hit with a baton instead?

[JustKeepSwimming]

Could someone kindly explain to me why saying **** in public is a crime routinely enforced but climbing over a war memorial to raise a foreign flag isn't? I can't be the only one who thinks the latter is far more prone to disturb the peace than the first.

Police claiming there is no "specific" law that allowed them to make an arrest... outraging public decency seems to fit nicely to me.

[NotAllThere]

If Hamas has links to Hezbollah how on earth wiping Hamas in Gaza is going to fix anything? they will just rebuild and come back...

Come back? Pretty hard if they're mainly dead. It's not like their ranks are being filled from outside.

[DoctorStrangelove]

There we go: Rog reckons it was a false flag operation:

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/pink-floyd...201007070.html

Give me a minute while I burn his crap solo dvds.

Pink Floyd co-founder Roger Waters has been accused of anti-Semitism after claiming Hamas’s massacre was “thrown out of all proportion”.

The guitarist questioned the origins of the Oct 7 attack, which killed 1,400 Israelis, claiming it could have been a “false flag operation”.

Speaking to journalist Glenn Greenwald, Mr Waters asked “how the hell” Israel did not know the assault was coming.

“Didn’t the Israeli army … hear the bangs when they [Hamas] blew up whatever they had to blow up to get across the border? There’s something very fishy about that,” the 80-year-old said, adding he was “still a little down that rabbit hole”.

When asked whether the attack was justified, Mr Waters said: “We don’t know what they did do.”

“Was it justified for them to resist the occupation? Yeah. They’re absolutely legally and morally bound to resist the occupation since 1967,” he added.

Questioned on the targeting of Israeli civilians, Mr Waters said: “Of course I don’t condone that, but the thing was totally thrown out of all proportion by the Israelis making up stories about beheading babies.”

“What we do know is, whether it was a false flag operation or not … and whatever story we’re going to get to … it’s always hard to tell what actually happened.”

A spokesman for Campaign Against Antisemitism, which in September released a documentary on Mr Waters and allegations of anti-Semitism told The Telegraph: “Surprise surprise. Roger Waters casts doubt on the Hamas massacre of Jews.”

“This is the same man who, as we revealed in our recent documentary, wanted to emblazon ‘dirty k–e’ on a pig, referred to ‘Jew food’, called his agent a ‘f—--g Jew’ and did an impression of a Holocaust victim,” the spokesman said.

“When it comes to Jews, there is no low to which Mr Waters will not sink. Decent people recognise his type.”

In May, Mr Waters appeared on stage in Berlin wearing an outfit that closely resembled a Nazi uniform.

The musician, a vocal pro-Palestinian activist, has always insisted he is not an anti-Semite and said the performance was “quite clearly a statement in opposition to fascism, injustice and bigotry in all its forms”.

He has previously floated an inflatable pig emblazoned with the Star of David at his concerts.

[vetran]

If Hamas has links to Hezbollah how on earth wiping Hamas in Gaza is going to fix anything? they will just rebuild and come back, either in a year or 10 or 20, doesn't matter, for them it seems that time doesn't really matter, but they will carry on doing "terrorist stuff" backed by other tulipheads.

I agree they are hoping.

I suspect the sponsors and leaders of terror will start having accidents assisted by Israeli commandos. Strikes me as the only way they will stop it. Keep cutting the head off.

Once every Hamas, Hezbollah leader and Iran's etc paymasters are dead people may reconsider.

All the time they get support from the lovies then no chance.

[woody1]

Iran is the puppet master...

With Putin egging them on?

It certainly suits him having another conflict going on, drawing attention away from Ukraine.

[JustKeepSwimming]

I think the Israelis are hoping removing Hamas will allow Gaza to be safer. At least wiping them out will send a strong message. They must be really pissed off the UN etc aren't backing them.

To be fair I doubt it will solve the problem, Hamas and their like want Israel obliterated.

It will improve their security in the short term if only by eliminating many Hamas fighters and their weapons. They have also indicated they aren't going to give Gaza any wiggle room moving forward. God knows about the cost to their military and any greater risk caused by the perception of their actions.

I think it's pretty telling that Israel's neighbours have been surprisingly silent. Which I think is a good sign for the future. They might be calling for a ceasefire but they have made it pretty clear that they don't feel obliged to intervene in Israel affairs militarily. Which is at a minimum tacit recognition that Israel is a real State.

Hezbollah leader gave a speech last week that they aren't ready to assist in the 'resistance'. Whether because they think Hamas went too far, and their ideology is a threat to them, or because they genuinely fear the US would intervene if a second front was opened up.

Hezbollah and Hamas are very much an 'enemy of my enemy is my friend'. They aren't actual allies.

What the blue haired leftists don't recognise is that this is a West v Iran cold war. Iran is the puppet master behind all the conflicts in the middle east. Iran is the threat that forced the Saudis, Egyptians, Jordans and what remains of Lebanon to move towards normalising relations with Israel. Iran is the treat that is causing Egypt and Jordan to stay out of it. Iran is the threat causing both Sunak and Starmer to ignore public opinion regarding a ceasefire (Which I give huge credit to Starmer). The war is Yemen is the Saudis fighting what is frankly Iranian imperialism.

For all the talk of Hamas being the problem, the reality is it is Iran, and I genuinely say that with a heavy heart because I do believe there are many Iranians, true Iranians who detest their religiously extremists Government as we have seen by the numerous mass protests and civil unrests.

Peace in the middle east can only begin with the toppling of the Iranian regime.

[dsc]

I think the Israelis are hoping removing Hamas will allow Gaza to be safer. At least wiping them out will send a strong message. They must be really pissed off the UN etc aren't backing them.

To be fair I doubt it will solve the problem, Hamas and their like want Israel obliterated.

If Hamas has links to Hezbollah how on earth wiping Hamas in Gaza is going to fix anything? they will just rebuild and come back, either in a year or 10 or 20, doesn't matter, for them it seems that time doesn't really matter, but they will carry on doing "terrorist stuff" backed by other tulipheads.

[vetran]

I can't say I have seen any evidence that removing Hamas will solve anything (other than improve Israel immediate security). If there isn't an active resistance to Hamas currently what evidence is there that Palestinians won't just 'elect' another extremists group?

I know people don't like to accept it, as it can come across as victim blaming, but populations tend to get the 'government' they deserve, ie if they aren't willing to fight with blood for democracy then democracy won't prevail.

I think the Israelis are hoping removing Hamas will allow Gaza to be safer. At least wiping them out will send a strong message. They must be really pissed off the UN etc aren't backing them.

To be fair I doubt it will solve the problem, Hamas and their like want Israel obliterated.

[JustKeepSwimming]

I can't say I have seen any evidence that removing Hamas will solve anything (other than improve Israel immediate security). If there isn't an active resistance to Hamas currently what evidence is there that Palestinians won't just 'elect' another extremists group?

I know people don't like to accept it, as it can come across as victim blaming, but populations tend to get the 'government' they deserve, ie if they aren't willing to fight with blood for democracy then democracy won't prevail.

[vetran]

Well, not quite as nasty as Hamas, but they did use waterboarding and other torture methods. And extra judicial killing.

NAT meet Sarcasm!

[NotAllThere]

makes the IRA look like amateurs who only kneecap people.

Well, not quite as nasty as Hamas, but they did use waterboarding and other torture methods. And extra judicial killing.