Reply to: Use of the word GAmmon is a racist slur

[OwlHoot]

This is a joke, right??

Yes of course. I don't give a stuff who calls who a gammon or snowflake, or anything else for that matter.

[Old Greg]

Pertinent advice from the Mash.

How to comment on Mail Online
9th April 2019

ARE you unsure how to jump into commenting in the bearpit of vicious invective that is the Daily Mail’s website? Here’s how:

Coherence is for lefties


Instead of taking the extra seconds to make your point clear, take a scattershot approach bringing in Corbyn, Churchill, Kourtney Kardashian, what your mate told you about wind turbines and CBeebies liberal bias.


Hate everything

Mail Online comments are basically an online therapy session for life’s losers, so vent your bitterness against everything. If a cute kitten has been given a prosthetic leg, ask why the limb wasn’t given to a British soldier maimed in ‘one of Tony B Liar’s wars’.

Keep your views just to the right of Hitler

Don’t just be a suburban fascist. Instead come at issues from a weird ultra-right perspective utterly divorced from reality, for example calling Tory chancellor Philip Hammond a ‘hard-left Fidel Castro communist’.

Make the old ‘Who?’ joke

Prove just how reactionary you are by pretending to be ignorant of globally famous figures such as Taylor Swift by commenting ‘Who?’ like a High Court judge in the 1960s. Extra points if you only do it to women.

Bring your personal bugbear into everything

Against the EU? Well, that’s germane to Brexit, Harry and Meghan, Easter eggs, Holly Willoughby’s diet news, a viral cip of a lizard in a bowling alley and a scare scory about building society interest rates. Get it on.

Stupidly-punctuated racism

If you’re slagging Muslims – it’s always Muslims – use punctuation to confuse software filtering out racism, eg ‘M.u.S – li .ms’. Much as Germans in the 1930s would write to Der Sturmer about ‘d-i.e J_u_den’.

[Uncle Albert]

So, it obviously isn't, since you say that it is intended only to apply to people based on their political leanings.

Not all white skinned people go red when they get upset.
Donald Trump is a right wing xenophobic racist, but he's not a gammon as he stays orange.
Likewise Stephen Yaxley-Lennon, he stays white.
There's plenty of white supremacists in the world who don't go red when their snowflakery is upset, and they demonstrate zero tolerance for anyone who doesn't fully agree with them.

He might not be a gammon, but he certainly has hammish tendencies...

[NotAllThere]

This is a joke, right??

I think it was intended that way. It certainly made me chuckle.

If you drink a bottle of whiskey, and then say "Racist", you get a racist slur.

[cojak]

That makes it even more offensive, because it is stereotyping white people with a disability, which is that by involuntarily going red in the face when angry they are disadvantaged by being unable to conceal their anger!

This is a joke, right??

[Whorty]

That makes it even more offensive, because it is stereotyping white people with a disability, which is that by involuntarily going red in the face when angry they are disadvantaged by being unable to conceal their anger!

Is the little snowflake getting a bit upset? Diddums Maybe MTFU and you'll feel a bit better

[NotAllThere]

It obviously is, because in the sense used today it is intended to portray or suggest an image of someone red in the face with indignation, which applies only to a white person.

Not so. Chinese folk can go red in the face with anger. Especially if they've had a drink and are naturally alcohol intolerant.

[xoggoth]

We should make up our own words, then we can express our hatred/loathing/contempt and not get banned from CUK.

You - you're a flibackorpstic, and you - a total estamogedgealop!

[OwlHoot]

Not all white skinned people go red when they get upset. ...

That makes it even more offensive, because it is stereotyping white people with a disability, which is that by involuntarily going red in the face when angry they are disadvantaged by being unable to conceal their anger!

[WTFH]

It obviously is, because it is intended to portray or suggest an image of someone red in the face with indignation, which applies only to a white person.

It is also stupid because, although intended to refer to reactionary right-wingers, it could equally apply to militant left wingers.

So, it obviously isn't, since you say that it is intended only to apply to people based on their political leanings.

Not all white skinned people go red when they get upset.
Donald Trump is a right wing xenophobic racist, but he's not a gammon as he stays orange.
Likewise Stephen Yaxley-Lennon, he stays white.
There's plenty of white supremacists in the world who don't go red when their snowflakery is upset, and they demonstrate zero tolerance for anyone who doesn't fully agree with them.

[OwlHoot]

You have failed to give any argument as to why gammon, is a racist term. ..

It obviously is, because in the sense used today it is intended to portray or suggest an image of someone red in the face with indignation, which applies only to a white person.

It is also stupid because, although intended to refer to reactionary right-wingers, it could equally apply to militant left wingers.

[jamesbrown]

That's the spirit!

Great banter!

[Old Greg]

You're the one with bipolar sockies, you cretinous gammonflake.

That's the spirit!

[jamesbrown]

It's always a good time if it makes you feel better about your inadequacies.

You're the one with bipolar sockies, you cretinous gammonflake.

[Old Greg]

Turns out, Charles Dickens invented the concept of “gammon” in 1838

Turns out, Charles Dickens invented the concept of “gammon” in 1838
Am I dreaming, though?

BY JONN ELLEDGE

PUBLIC DOMAIN.

There are times when I wonder if I’m awake at all – when the more plausible explanation for the state of the world seems to be that I'm midway through a particularly bizarre dream. One such occasion was when I learned that TV writer Steven Knight was in talks over a ballet version of his inter-war Birmingham gangster drama, Peaky Blinders.

And another came about an hour ago when an old mate of mine, who tweets anonymously under the name @protooptimism, pointed out that the phrase “gammon tendency” is used in Dickens to refer to, well, roughly the same sort of jingoism that popular political meme “gammon” is used to refer to now.

It's chapter 16 of Nicholas Nickleby, first published in 1838, where the phrase appears. The scene is the Westminster office of Mr Gregsbury, an MP who’s described as “a tough, burly, thick-headed gentleman, with a loud voice, a pompous manner, a tolerable command of sentences with no meaning in them, and, in short, every requisite for a very good member indeed”.


A number of Gregsbury's constituents have shown up, infuriated by his recent conduct, and are calling on him to resign. Gregsbury's defence is, in short, that whatever terrible behaviour he may have indulged in was the result of nothing more than loving his country too much:

"‘My conduct, Pugstyles,’ said Mr Gregsbury, looking round upon the deputation with gracious magnanimity —‘my conduct has been, and ever will be, regulated by a sincere regard for the true and real interests of this great and happy country. Whether I look at home, or abroad; whether I behold the peaceful industrious communities of our island home: her rivers covered with steamboats, her roads with locomotives, her streets with cabs, her skies with balloons of a power and magnitude hitherto unknown in the history of aeronautics in this or any other nation — I say, whether I look merely at home, or, stretching my eyes farther, contemplate the boundless prospect of conquest and possession — achieved by British perseverance and British valour — which is outspread before me, I clasp my hands, and turning my eyes to the broad expanse above my head, exclaim, “Thank Heaven, I am a Briton!”’

This goes down about as well as it would if Liam Fox tried it, which he almost certainly will before long, and it's at that point that an observer notes that Gregsbury is a bit, well, gammon:

"The time had been, when this burst of enthusiasm would have been cheered to the very echo; but now, the deputation received it with chilling coldness. The general impression seemed to be, that as an explanation of Mr Gregsbury’s political conduct, it did not enter quite enough into detail; and one gentleman in the rear did not scruple to remark aloud, that, for his purpose, it savoured rather too much of a ‘gammon’ tendency.”


As with many of those described using this term, however, Gregsbury is confused by the insult:

"‘The meaning of that term — gammon,’ said Mr Gregsbury, ‘is unknown to me. If it means that I grow a little too fervid, or perhaps even hyperbolical, in extolling my native land, I admit the full justice of the remark. I AM proud of this free and happy country. My form dilates, my eye glistens, my breast heaves, my heart swells, my bosom burns, when I call to mind her greatness and her glory.’”


So: 180 years ago, the 26 year old Charles Dickens was already using the word “gammon” to describe a large, self-satisfied, middle aged man who professes an extreme patriotism in large part to disguise his essential selfishness and corruption.

Either Dickens was a prophet, or I am literally dreaming.


UPDATE: Correspondents tell me that the word “gammon” was actually a Victorian slang term, which translates, roughly, as “bulltulip”. Interpreting it in this as a man pushing a certain type of jingoism is Gregsbury’s alone. So, there you go.