Cameron in Europe - Good or Crap?

[AtW]

Oh, by the way, some great things about EU -

1) single trademark can be applied for
2) single patent can be filed

In fact EU patent office is a bit more open to allowing patents than UK patent office - so my company filed patents in EU, which would also make them (if they get granted) valid in UK too.

[xoggoth]

The EU commission (unelected) makes the rules, the EU parliament has no real power

Quite correct. The Commission, unelected as you say, is the top EU body. Seriously, if we had to vote for a party and had no clue who would actually be in a government formed by backdoor deals would we call it democracy?

Generally, it is the European Commission that proposes new laws.

http://www.gr2014parliament.eu/Porta...090ENC_002.pdf

[darmstadt]

One interesting fact about this referendum is that members of the Commonwealth are allowed to vote in it although people from the EU who are resident in the UK, possibly for many years, are not. Why do members of the Commonwealth get to vote in it although they can't vote in the EU elections?

[AtW]

Seriously, if we had to vote for a party and had no clue who would actually be in a government formed by backdoor deals would we call it democracy?

But that's what actually happens in this country, isn't it?

I voted for tax-cutting Tory Party that pledged to reduce Govt spending, yet I don't know wtf is now running the country?!?!

The only real democracy is in Switzerland with referendum system - backed up population with military training and assault rifles at home. It's the only other way to be sure.

[xoggoth]

And that's a bad thing???

It's a totally unnecessary thing, just a pointless waste of money. How much TV is transmitted between nations, when did you last watch Belgium TV? Just one of the sillier examples but we are paying a lot for rules on water treatment etc. There are some things whose impact is so local they are best handled locally in accordance with local priorities. As I said earlier there are big differences in economies and societies and a uniform approach sometimes makes no real sense.

In many, the majority of cases I'd say, the existing British laws on water management, pollution, farming, road safety etc were generally pretty good before these EU regulations. What has happened is that we and other more prosperous European nations picked up the bill for framing laws which were only inadequate in some others.

Here we go, list of EU regulations. I shall be testing you all on them tomorrow.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/browse/dire...gislation.html

[darmstadt]

It's a totally unnecessary thing, just a pointless waste of money. How much TV is transmitted between nations, when did you last watch Belgium TV? Just one of the sillier examples but we are paying a lot for rules on water treatment etc. There are some things whose impact is so local they are best handled locally in accordance with local priorities. As I said earlier there are big differences in economies and societies and a uniform approach makes no real sense. in some cases.

Yesterday as I needed to catch up on something, today I watched French and Italian.

[AtW]

It's a totally unnecessary thing

It was totally necessary to make it easier to sell same TVs into single market - totally important for radio related stuff. What if some idiot Tories sold those frequences on the cheap to some of their buddies in big mobile companies???

Pick a better example.

Maybe one that allowed (or not) prisoners to vote in General Election? If I remember correctly Tories were foaming at their mouth on that one - I guess they just did not want to end up with majority vote in prisons or worse - mental hospitals: 9 out of 10 Napoleons will pick Tory party

[original PM]

I will be voting out because some of my relatives fought and died so that we would not have to pander to a centralised European government

[darmstadt]

I will be voting out because some of my relatives fought and died so that we would not have to pander to a centralised European government

Twat. My relatives did as well but then they went on to fight for a better Europe which is slowly being unraveled by people like you.

[original PM]

Twat. My relatives did as well but then they went on to fight for a better Europe which is slowly being unraveled by people like you.

England is an island nation and we have been ruling ourselves for a lot longer than any European union has existed.

I just think the Eu would be better served concentrating on some of the emerging nations than worrying about a 'self sufficient' small island in the top left corner.

Why do you want the UK to stay in?