State of the Market

[tsmith]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYdQokymSJY

"Im a head of product so I hire Product Managers, a year ago I would open a PM role and within 24 hours it would get 80 to 90 applicants. Now within 24 hours it gets 400 applicants.

In the past 12 months we've hired 20 people - only 2 were 'cold applicants' - the rest were referred in

If I was on the job market right now - I wouldnt waste any time applying for a role where I didnt have someone that could refer me in

I would spend my time applying for roles where my friends and contacts work"

Yea good one mate - but after a week when youve exhausted your old contacts - and you're still out of work cos your contacts companies arent hiring - what do you do then?

[hobnob]

Seems things are desperate for recruiters as well

I had a message from a recruiter on LinkedIn (since I've listed my client as my employer):

I wanted to reach out directly with the new financial year just around the corner to see whether you guys had any plans to scale your tech team. I appreciate the market has been quiet lately, and as a recruiter things have been very tough so I hope you dont mind the direct approach.

I have almost 7 years’ experience in the market and joined [REDACTED] over a year ago to head up our IT division, specialising in all forms of tech from VSM positions, all the way down to entry level roles in the market on both a permanent and contract basis across The UK, Europe & US.

First up, that echoes the previous post, i.e. saying that this is a bad time to be a recruiter. Secondly, the bit about their experience makes it look like a covering letter for a job application!

[sreed]

Different sectors - private and public - but both wanted strong soft skills and someone who has done the job for a long time and can get going quickly without upsetting the natives.

Fundamentally, as a Project Manager contractor, based on what I can see in market, I have a similar opinion as expressed in the post above.

I would caveat that I’m not and have never been a pure IT PM so I don’t know what the situation in that space is.

But as far as tech-ish PM roles go, there are a decent number of contracts for people with the right skills and experience especially in the change/transformation space, regulatory projects, finance system projects, etc. The PS seems to have dialled down their PM requirements in the past year but opportunities in the private sector are there.

If you can get to London 1-2 days a week (I can’t) then it gets even better as a lot of the well paid PM roles I see (eg: Insurance) are still concentrated in London and I’d think that’s unlikely to change in the foreseeable future.

[dsc]

I was meant to relocate and go perm at my current client...turns out that deal is off the table, I'll probably just get the boot in a few months time

At the same time, absolutely no contracts in my field of work and it's been like this since early last year. Perm positions still paying 2010 salaries Ffs and here's me planning to leave the UK

[Cookielove]

It is incredibly tough at the moment, I was out of work 8 months last year and almost cracked up.

Did loads of applications and never heard back, all sorts of shenanigans.

I'm in a role but it is rubbish I grabbed it for sake on my sanity and needed the ££ but it is chaos and every day is crap...toxic management am able to stick it for now as I'm pretty much remote...

Really hope things change soon as it is all so depressing at the moment...can't remember times being so tough before

[Bluenose]

Really hope things change soon as it is all so depressing at the moment...can't remember times being so tough before

The thing is, if an outsider watched the Budget presentation by the chancellor and then also read this thread, it appears there are two different worlds. One presented by a politician and one being experienced in daily-life.

Politics is for general but the treasury seems so out of touch with what's going on and what has been going on for almost a year.

[Fraidycat]

The thing is, if an outsider watched the Budget presentation by the chancellor and then also read this thread, it appears there are two different worlds. One presented by a politician and one being experienced in daily-life.

Politics is for general but the treasury seems so out of touch with what's going on and what has been going on for almost a year.

Politicians lie and spin. But the grim UK GDP numbers are there for everyone to see.

The thing is perm roles in general, 80% of the population, things never go backwards in terms of wages. It is forward only, and they been giving everyone at lower end 10% pay rises.

Contractors make big money during the boom times and but we take a bigger hit during down turns. More volatility but hopefully higher overall income over the long run. It is a bit like tech stocks vs value stocks.

[edison]

Fundamentally, as a Project Manager contractor, based on what I can see in market, I have a similar opinion as expressed in the post above.

I would caveat that I’m not and have never been a pure IT PM so I don’t know what the situation in that space is.

But as far as tech-ish PM roles go, there are a decent number of contracts for people with the right skills and experience especially in the change/transformation space, regulatory projects, finance system projects, etc. The PS seems to have dialled down their PM requirements in the past year but opportunities in the private sector are there.

If you can get to London 1-2 days a week (I can’t) then it gets even better as a lot of the well paid PM roles I see (eg: Insurance) are still concentrated in London and I’d think that’s unlikely to change in the foreseeable future.

I've done a short contract stint in insurance and I totally agree with the above. It seems to be the one sector that is in good health, relatively speaking. 95% of the time you need sector experience though.

[PCTNN]

and here's me planning to leave the UK

well this is a great move. it's never too late to leave a sinking ship.

[tsmith]

I've done a short contract stint in insurance and I totally agree with the above. It seems to be the one sector that is in good health, relatively speaking. 95% of the time you need sector experience though.

True. Chances of getting a role without sector experience as good as zero these days.

Requirements go hot and cold all over the place too. Seems Scrum is less hot now and old school "Project Management" is back. Saw Prince 2 yesterday lol. Really Prince 2 in 2024. The death of waterfall greatly exaggerated - its back and this time its personal.

And *data* seems the new hot one from nowhere. Lets put data in front of half of all roles. Is it really *data* though? You mean theres a SQL database as part of the project?

Get a career in IT - no matter if you have 25 years experience in 25 companies in every imaginable vertical and tech stack it will never be *exactly* what we require.

And then by the time you have 25 years experience you will be too old for us anyway.