BN66 - Time to fight back: Continued

[JMK]

Another lurker

Hi there,

Firstly, thanks to the originators of this (and the previous) thread - it's an excellent resource for getting up to speed with what's going on. (Ignoring the borderline psycho responses and the impressive trolling)

I have about 3 years worth of exposure to the MP DTT arrangement. Stashed all proceeds away so have no problem paying it off (I'd always assumed that until we got the all-clear it was safest to do this).

Now that it looks like a JR is going to be initiated, and my expectation that it's going to run for a few years, I'm looking at doing one of the following:
1) Get a CTD
2) Make a payment on account

I understand all the benefits of a CTD - but I'm seriously considering 2, as my belief is that I'll get a much better rate of interest, when MP eventually win. I don't need to money now, nor in all likelihood will I need it in the future, so I can't see any problem with making a payment on account when the closure notices come through.

Can anyone see any flaws in my thinking?

[malvolio]

I entirely agree. Although the will of parliament is an important factor in legislation it is only supposed to be relevant when the written legislation is unclear; personally I am far from convinced that the exemption for partnership income in the DTA is unclear - but I think it was probably unintentional. It is entirely unreasonable for parliament to say "what I meant was". If that is what they meant then that is what they should have written in the legislation.

And to be entirely fair to HMG (just this once ) they are now being very conscientious about inviting comment on any proposals, and circulating drafts consultation copies to lots of relevant places.

That includes the PCG, incidentally, so if you want an early sight of their thinking and the ability to put your own case, get in there; their submissions have been acted upon, more than once, and they're looking for input on things like the Taxpayer's Charter, Umbrella expenses and the interest on owed balances right now.

I also get the feelling the Cvil Servants are tired of trying to make bad ideas work, and are looking for realistic approaches instead of political ones.

[Douglas]

Payment on account

Hi there,

Now that it looks like a JR is going to be initiated, and my expectation that it's going to run for a few years, I'm looking at doing one of the following:
1) Get a CTD
2) Make a payment on account

I understand all the benefits of a CTD - but I'm seriously considering 2, as my belief is that I'll get a much better rate of interest, when MP eventually win. I don't need to money now, nor in all likelihood will I need it in the future, so I can't see any problem with making a payment on account when the closure notices come through.

Can anyone see any flaws in my thinking?

I am coming to the same conclusion - the rate of return on the CTD is poor so I may pay HMRC with it when the bill arrives. MP seem to have left it up to us to decide and are no longer suggesting it will affect any inspector's view of the situation.

[ASB]

I don't need to money now, nor in all likelihood will I need it in the future, so I can't see any problem with making a payment on account when the closure notices come through.

If you're that confident of winning just leave the money in your favourite capital/investment generating investment. Don't forget to appeal your closure notice though.

[JMK]

not that confident Just optimistic. If we do lose, I'd like to avoid incurring further interest charges, but if we win I'd rather get a better rate of interest.

I can see how the CTD is desirable if you might want to get your hands on the money (unexpected bills, divorce etc), but if you've got a safety-net and can commit to life without the funds, paying on account looks like the better option.

Having said all of that, my googling hasn't yet found the chapter and verse indicating the rate/any maximum limits for this.

[Ratican]

What I think...

My understanding is that the JR will not take long to complete (maybe in the 1st quarter 2009) and if MP lose - that will be the end of it - no more options. (??)

If MP win that is when the process could start taking some time. (??)

[Hawkwind]

Hi there,

Now that it looks like a JR is going to be initiated, and my expectation that it's going to run for a few years, I'm looking at doing one of the following:
1) Get a CTD
2) Make a payment on account

I understand all the benefits of a CTD - but I'm seriously considering 2, as my belief is that I'll get a much better rate of interest, when MP eventually win. I don't need to money now, nor in all likelihood will I need it in the future, so I can't see any problem with making a payment on account when the closure notices come through.

Can anyone see any flaws in my thinking?

How about that with option 2 you are unlikely to get any money back at all even if MP win.
I guess the CTD route is a viable option for those that can afford it but I would rather keep my money out their hands for as long as possible. Also my exposure is so great that the £10k per year or so extra interest isn't going to make a whole lot of difference to me - I don't think it is possible to be "more" ruined.
I do find at a bit alarming that perople are starting to consider the Payment on Account as surely this is just giving in to what HMRC want.

[JMK]

How about that with option 2 you are unlikely to get any money back at all even if MP win.

Is that true? My understanding (which I've checked with MP) is that the only material difference is that I can't cash in a payment on account and get the money back anytime I like, unless of course MP win. In which case I'll get the cash back plus a better rate of interest than a CTD.

It's not like we can hide from HMRC on this, the wheels are in motion, MP either win or lose. Minimizing interest seems the most sensible idea if you have the money, if you're considering a CTD then it seems sensible to consider payment on account.

Is there any practical benefit to HMRC of a payment on account with a disputed closure notice, vs a CTD and a disputed closure notice?

[Ratican]

I do find at a bit alarming that perople are starting to consider the Payment on Account as surely this is just giving in to what HMRC want.

I think that payment on account and settle are 2 different things. There's more information on the "old" thread.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

I understand all the benefits of a CTD - but I'm seriously considering 2, as my belief is that I'll get a much better rate of interest, when MP eventually win. I don't need to money now, nor in all likelihood will I need it in the future, so I can't see any problem with making a payment on account when the closure notices come through.

Can anyone see any flaws in my thinking?

Nothing I can put my finger on but something about making a payment on account makes me feel very uneasy. Perhaps I'm being paranoid but I just don't trust HMRC, and probably with good reason!

Can anyone think of any scenarios where paying on account could backfire?