No To Retro Tax - Ongoing battle against S58 FA2008

[bombaycat]

Section 9A TMA 1970 Enquiry validity

What is the cut off date for opening an enquiry for 05/06.

Following a Data Protection request i received:

copy of letter sent to MTM (not me) in Oct 07 asking for info, no ref to 19a TMA 70 notice
Copy of letter to me (but not received) May 08 giving notice to provide documents It does mention 19a TMA 70 notice
Copy of letter Nov 08, first one i did receive saying as you are aware, etc, and including 6/7 in the general enquiry, and suggest i may wish to amend the SA for 6/7.

I did receive the proper notice for 7/8.

Does the lack of notice in the general inquiry invalidate 56 & 6/7 given it was first raised in May 08?

Any suggestions on next steps?

I think the deadline for opening an enquiry is:
30th Jan 2008 for 05/06
30th Jan 2009 for 06/07
etc
it actually says that in one of the Freedom of info sheets they sent me a couple of years back when I asked -the dealines and checkboxes were listed.

I think that if the Section 9A TMA 1970 reference was not required then they wouldn't have bothered putting it on all the subsequent ones I got and they wouldn't bother to doctor (if that is what has happened) the "copies" that they have sent to other people on this forum to add it in. Interestingly they did not doctor the copy they sent me a while back as previously mentioned.

Sounds like if an agent has complied and given info off the back of the 19A TMA 1970 Info request (mine was also May 2008 for 05/06) then they may be open to a PI claim as the request for info may not have been valid - I would be more inclined to argue that the subsequent Closure Notice under 28A TMA 1970 was invalid due to the lack of 9A Enquiry personally. Seems more fair to go after the "real" villains here. Maybe that will be indeed be possible - I've sent scans to MP of my queried enquiry. Fingers crossed as 35% of my numbers would go away if that were the case.

[bombaycat]

another new joiner

+1 NTRT joiner whipped into shape....

[smalldog]

A couple of my letters for years said they would just be included in the existing enquiry. They didnt mention TMA etc. does that mean they could be invalid? I did ask Dawn and she said they are all in order, I assume MP to be the experts in this area.

[SleepingFireman]

APNS arrived

APN for 05/06 and 06/07 arrived Friday. Figures appear to be correct but exclude NI at this stage.

Correspondence from HRMC appears in order. Although they didn't mention the 06/07 return until April 2010 citing a discovery assessment. Is that outside the permitted enquiry window?

[webberg]

APN for 05/06 and 06/07 arrived Friday. Figures appear to be correct but exclude NI at this stage.

Correspondence from HRMC appears in order. Although they didn't mention the 06/07 return until April 2010 citing a discovery assessment. Is that outside the permitted enquiry window?

A discovery assessment must be issued within 4 years of the end of the tax year to which it relates and can be appealed against.

I would have thought that the existence of a discovery assessment means that the period to open an enquiry was missed and that means in turn that an APN should not be issued (not an open year). Instead resolution is via agreeing/litigating the discovery assessment.

That latter issue falls into two parts, one- is the assessment valid, i.e. was there a "discovery" and two - is the "income" taxable?

[elpinar]

I would have thought that the existence of a discovery assessment means that the period to open an enquiry was missed and that means in turn that an APN should not be issued (not an open year).

ooow ..... so if i have discovery notices for two years i should not also have APNS for them ?

if that what you are saying ... thats interseting for sure

[DonkeyRhubarb]

I would have thought that the existence of a discovery assessment means that the period to open an enquiry was missed and that means in turn that an APN should not be issued (not an open year).

The APN legislation doesn't just cover open enquiries. An APN can also be issued where tax is under appeal by virtue of an assessment, amendment or closure notice.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

ooow ..... so if i have discovery notices for two years i should not also have APNS for them ?

if that what you are saying ... thats interseting for sure

Sadly I don't think this is true.

[elpinar]

The APN legislation doesn't just cover open enquiries. An APN can also be issued where tax is under appeal by virtue of an assessment, amendment or closure notice.

so if when i go on line i see tax owed 0 and no amount in the outstanding or other box at the bottom (or whtever it is ) shoudl i have been able to be sent an APN for that ?

[DonkeyRhubarb]

Invalid enquiries

I would be more inclined to argue that the subsequent Closure Notice under 28A TMA 1970 was invalid due to the lack of 9A Enquiry personally.

Agreed, that is the way to go.

But HMRC are very unlikely to concede. Ultimately you would have to take a case to the FTT.

I definitely think it's worth challenging the CN though. I have tweaked the previous letter to include the 9a.

It would certainly help your case if HMRC supplied a doctored copy of an existing letter.

Dear Sir,

I am writing concerning the Closure Notice you issued for tax year 200x-200y.

I have no record of HMRC opening a valid enquiry under Section 9a TMA 1970 for this year.

That being the case, I hereby request that you withdraw the Closure Notice.

Yours faithfully,