Public sector IR35 consultation launched

[WordIsBond]

+1 and isn't it a fact that the extra divi tax has been omiited from the figure?

Well, they SAY it is for 2016-2017, and the divi tax applies to that tax year.

So obviously, if this number is right and their old number is right then there are many more PSCs making a lot more money in 2016-17 than the year before, so as to keep the answer the same, right?

Somebody said HMRC bods monitor this page. If they do, every time that figure is cited I hope they have the decency to blush.

It's so very revealing. The tax goes up on those outside IR35, and the number doesn't change. If the number were based on a calculation, of course, that number would be easy to change. Since it didn't change, it means either it is either pulled out of their nether regions or they were too stupid to change the tax rate in their calculations. And why IPSE doesn't issue a press release every time this number appears saying so is beyond me.

"HMRC is STILL using this obviously wrong number and won't justify it, so how much else is just wrong in the stuff they are putting out." I don't have a megaphone, but IPSE does.

[eek]

I think its because they thought there was some logic behind it rather than blind guesswork. Turns out what the rest of us suspected was true after all.

Between this and another discover today (regarding council tax and government grants) I'm utterly unimpressed with the Civil Service....

[kolata]

How can all this work?

Here is a situation.

There are 2 contractors in public sector body. There is a system in this office which has been designed and run and modified by contractors for the last 10+ years.
Now the only 2 people who can run it and maintain it are the said 2 contractors. No one of the permies has the skills/knowledge/experience to run it.
There is no control or direction by the permies/organization on how the contractors should run the system. Is really up to them as long as it just works.

The contractors can work whenever, but generally business hours.

How can the agency or client or anyone really say these contractors do the same as permies or whatever so they will have to be inside it35?

[Fred Bloggs]

Because in the parallel universe of HMG and HMRC, they are caught. And that's all that really matters to them.

[eek]

How can all this work?

Here is a situation.

There are 2 contractors in public sector body. There is a system in this office which has been designed and run and modified by contractors for the last 10+ years.
Now the only 2 people who can run it and maintain it are the said 2 contractors. No one of the permies has the skills/knowledge/experience to run it.
There is no control or direction by the permies/organization on how the contractors should run the system. Is really up to them as long as it just works.

The contractors can work whenever, but generally business hours.

How can the agency or client or anyone really say these contractors do the same as permies or whatever so they will have to be inside it35?

The question may well be under what framework are they employed.

Contracted directly they may not have a problem. Employed via CLone they appear to be screwed.

[MrMarkyMark]

How can all this work?

Here is a situation.

There are 2 contractors in public sector body. There is a system in this office which has been designed and run and modified by contractors for the last 10+ years.
Now the only 2 people who can run it and maintain it are the said 2 contractors. No one of the permies has the skills/knowledge/experience to run it.
There is no control or direction by the permies/organization on how the contractors should run the system. Is really up to them as long as it just works.

The contractors can work whenever, but generally business hours.

How can the agency or client or anyone really say these contractors do the same as permies or whatever so they will have to be inside it35?

Obviously they will argue that the roles, specialist or otherwise, should be perm if they have existed for 10 (!) years.

As for the practicalities of the situation they simply don't care.

[kolata]

Obviously they will argue that the roles, specialist or otherwise, should be perm if they have existed for 10 (!) years.

As for the practicalities of the situation they simply don't care.

I know they might argue a lot of things.
Would a tribunal care about the practicalities or indeed about the reality of it?

[MrMarkyMark]

I know they might argue a lot of things.
Would a tribunal care about the practicalities or indeed about the reality of it?

What sort of tribunal?

I mean you just said you weren't an employee, didn't you?






e

[eek]

I know they might argue a lot of things.
Would a tribunal care about the practicalities or indeed about the reality of it?

What tribunal would you be aiming for?

The entire purpose of the new rules is to scare the public sector to pay you via paye and remove any incentive or ability for you to appeal...

[malvolio]

Obviously they will argue that the roles, specialist or otherwise, should be perm if they have existed for 10 (!) years.[.

Don't be so sure. I've contracted out my water, electricity, gas and waste disposal for many years, I don't think I employ that many people...

As has been said already, it's about which framework they are covered by. CLOne will be caught but others may well not be.