Reply to: Even graduates are striking

[dsc]

They are not malicious, they are simply stopping working altogether, the intent here is to show everyone how p*ssed off they are by not doing what they normally do (also nurses still help is death threatening situations), not to cause harm to Ben and Becky who want to send some parcels somewhere or get a train to the local Christmas market. If they were malicious they would walk around setting houses on fire, or opening your letters and posting your personal details online.

I have to give it to the UK, I don't think there's currently another country that has so many groups on strike (or ever had?). So that's a win, well done.

Btw there should be some sort of national emergency re NHS and waiting times for ambulances, ffs there's a limit to how tulip a service can be.

Agreed but I think personally, and by the dictionary definition, they've been very malicious in the dates they've picked plus jumped in with other groups. Just the sentence above would technically meet the definition of malice so they are the same thing.

[SueEllen]

No point forcing the government to the negotiating table when they're not the employer. We have hospital trusts, rail network operators and so forth who act as the employer and ensure their industry is free from government interference from the workers POV

You forgot independent panels who recommend pay awards that the government ignores until now when inflation is over double the award.

Shame there is an increasing shortage of nursing staff....

[vetran]

No point forcing the government to the negotiating table when they're not the employer. We have hospital trusts, rail network operators and so forth who act as the employer and ensure their industry is free from government interference from the workers POV

But but but its all the unloving tories fault..

[tazdevil]

No point forcing the government to the negotiating table when they're not the employer. We have hospital trusts, rail network operators and so forth who act as the employer and ensure their industry is free from government interference from the workers POV

[d000hg]

I must admit, to some extent I'm with Zig on this one. Where the seed of discontent is with the workers, it's the Unions that take it up a level. The whole tone and the dates of the strikes are meant to be as disruptive and unpopular as possible so IMO there is malice there. I don't agree it's to bring down the govt but it is certainly to cause such an upset they are forced to act.

Everyone is unhappy about their pay, not just these groups. It's just they are headed up by particularly strong headed unions so get their voices heard whatever it takes.

There is no malice in wanting to strike for pay for sure, but the way the unions have orchastrated it shows great malice.

Strikes are supposed to be inconvenient. Otherwise it's just people not getting paid.
It's malice in the sense that strikes are designed to disrupt and demonstrate how important the striking workers are. But not in the sense that it's a coordinated scheme to get the government out, only to force the government to pay out - this is what I meant. There is no conspiracy here. Unions see that by joining in they all gain from the mounting pressure.

[northernladuk]

If you cause disruption to as many people as possible then your strike gets noticed.

Agreed but I think personally, and by the dictionary definition, they've been very malicious in the dates they've picked plus jumped in with other groups. Just the sentence above would technically meet the definition of malice so they are the same thing.

malice
(mælɪs )
UNCOUNTABLE NOUN
Malice is behavior that is intended to harm people or their reputations, or cause them embarrassment and upset.

Malicious, Malevolent, and Malice

Malicious and malevolent are close in meaning, since both refer to ill will that desires to see someone else suffer. But while malevolent suggests deep and lasting dislike, malicious usually means petty and spiteful.

So you are right they are doing it to get noticed but it's the way they are doing it with dates and all demonstrated a particular level of malice to get their point over. It's inextricably linked with action of this type.

[eek]

It's not malice it is publicity seeking.

If you cause disruption to as many people as possible then your strike gets noticed.

There have been random bus strikes over the country for a year. However unless you were directly affected by them you wouldn't have noticed and they only got in the local news. ( I noticed when some of the buses in my area weren't running but unlike many had alternative means of transport to get where I wanted to go. )

Round here there are so many bus driver vacancies you really couldn't tell if they are on strike, working to rule or just don't have anyone willing to work for the money they pay.

[SueEllen]

I must admit, to some extent I'm with Zig on this one. Where the seed of discontent is with the workers, it's the Unions that take it up a level. The whole tone and the dates of the strikes are meant to be as disruptive and unpopular as possible so IMO there is malice there. I don't agree it's to bring down the govt but it is certainly to cause such an upset they are forced to act.

Everyone is unhappy about their pay, not just these groups. It's just they are headed up by particularly strong headed unions so get their voices heard whatever it takes.

There is no malice in wanting to strike for pay for sure, but the way the unions have orchastrated it shows great malice.

It's not malice it is publicity seeking.

If you cause disruption to as many people as possible then your strike gets noticed.

There have been random bus strikes over the country for a year. However unless you were directly affected by them you wouldn't have noticed and they only got in the local news. ( I noticed when some of the buses in my area weren't running but unlike many had alternative means of transport to get where I wanted to go. )

[northernladuk]

Never attribute to malice...

Everyone is striking because everyone is miserable. One group striking plants the seed for others and it gathers pace. It's a symptom of the underlying malaise in the country, not a conspiracy.

I must admit, to some extent I'm with Zig on this one. Where the seed of discontent is with the workers, it's the Unions that take it up a level. The whole tone and the dates of the strikes are meant to be as disruptive and unpopular as possible so IMO there is malice there. I don't agree it's to bring down the govt but it is certainly to cause such an upset they are forced to act.

Everyone is unhappy about their pay, not just these groups. It's just they are headed up by particularly strong headed unions so get their voices heard whatever it takes.

There is no malice in wanting to strike for pay for sure, but the way the unions have orchastrated it shows great malice.

[Zigenare]

Never attribute to malice...

Everyone is striking because everyone is miserable. One group striking plants the seed for others and it gathers pace. It's a symptom of the underlying malaise in the country, not a conspiracy.

Absolute rubbish. This is political, hence the request for Union Leadership to talk directly with the PM - who incidently has FA to do with granting the pay rises.

[d000hg]

The objective of these co-ordinated strikes is not to highlight poor pay and conditions, it is to bring down the Government.

Never attribute to malice...

Everyone is striking because everyone is miserable. One group striking plants the seed for others and it gathers pace. It's a symptom of the underlying malaise in the country, not a conspiracy.

[Zigenare]

The objective of these co-ordinated strikes is not to highlight poor pay and conditions, it is to bring down the Government.

[d000hg]

I wanted to buy paint from a well-known online retailer yesterday and they said they cannot accept my order because DPD are no longer taking parcels in large parts of the country, in part due to knock on effect of RM strikes. So their company basically isn't selling anything.

My father set up an electrical business before I was born, I suppose in the 70s - it coincided with a bad patch of mail strikes and his business went under because of it - he returned to regular employment until he retired. There are a lot more couriers these days but even so, small businesses have a tough enough time as it is without strike action

[northernladuk]

I suspect the problem is that unless you can live at home with your parents £28,000 doesn't cover much rent in London. And if you are paying £1,000 or so a month on a flat share you don't have the lifestyle those who have the help of mum and dad offer.

Mind you round here you'll live there nicely on that sort of money - given that it is higher than the local median wage.

That's definitely the issue. I worked with a fast streamer in my PS gig in the midlands and he picked his next one in London because it's just where all the action really is which was true. He was going to do a house share with some other FS'ers but wasn't happy about the cost. That was five years ago and he's doing pretty darn well for himself now though.

Wish someone had asked me to if I wanted to go on strike over the amounts I was getting paid on the first two years of my YTS :|

[eek]

That was my thought as well. That said, apparently there are disproportionate numbers of sucessful applicatants from Oxbridge and other private institutions than state education so starting on less than one's butler may sting a bit.

They were complaining about their pay back in 2019 as well
https://www.civilserviceworld.com/pr...m-with-low-pay
Students complaining about how hard life is after getting a job that is 30/1 over subscribed and ending on only 38k after only three years. Whodathunkit.

I suspect the problem is that unless you can live at home with your parents £28,000 doesn't cover much rent in London. And if you are paying £1,000 or so a month on a flat share you don't have the lifestyle those who have the help of mum and dad offer.

Mind you round here you'll live there nicely on that sort of money - given that it is higher than the local median wage.