Reply to: How do you deal with "it's a remote contact but... we expect everyone in the office"

[dranzer01]

I did try that. It did not work.

If the contract was advertised as "remote" but at interview stage the client mumbled that everyone is expected in the office I would interrupt them and I'd clearly say I do not intend to go to the office ever. This should end the interview pretty quickly.

I remember I had a contract role and in the beginning the agency said its a remote role. A little down the line, I remember seeing a couple of emails saying two days in the office... I was confused , but I didn't say anything as I didn't want to ruffle the position in all honesty (But I wanted to work from home)

[northernladuk]

On my QDOS reviews and indeed the CEST tool, having my own unilateral choice of where to work has indeed counted in my favour. In both cases, it's listed under the Supervision, Direction and Control banner.

Possibly but it doesn't mean we have carte blanche to tell the client to bugger off when they need eyes on you for meetings, standups etc. None of us would have ever been outside ever if that was a factor. A flag at worst.

If you get a large consultancy in to supply desktop support and you stipulate it has to be done on site does that mean their contracts are inside? No. It's a business agreement made as part of the delivery of that service.

Now if you commence work and they start telling you on a day by day basis and you've no choice then yes that's above and beyond the contractual agreement and could be seen as controlling your work but as a supplier to a client professional courtesy to deliver to suit your client goes a long way.

[PerfectStorm]

On my QDOS reviews and indeed the CEST tool, having my own unilateral choice of where to work has indeed counted in my favour. In both cases, it's listed under the Supervision, Direction and Control banner.

[northernladuk]

Isn't the requirement to be in the office constantly kind of Direction and Control? I get that if you are needed to talk to clients etc. then fine, if the tech set up is so that you cannot get access from outside - also fine, but just to be there, bum in seat?

I'm sure that if you have some truly niche skills, then if you say "feck off, I'm fully remote", then you will be. If there's a long line of others to replace you, tough luck.

Not at all. It's more about professional courtesy and effective delivery. It's around the terms you are engaged on, not being told how or what to do in contract.

Also there is the argument that everyone working for the client would be on the same terms so similar to Health and Safety so doesn't differentiate a perm or supplier.

A brief summary of SDC is

For supervision to apply there must be someone overseeing another person doing the work to ensure that they are actually doing it and that the work is being done correctly to the required standard. Supervision can also involve aiding or assisting someone to develop their skills and knowledge.

Direction involves someone making another person do their work in a certain way, generally by providing instructions, guidance and advice as to how the work is to be done. Someone providing direction will often coordinate how the work is done as it is being undertaken.

Control is where you have someone dictating what work a person does and how they should go about doing that. This also includes the power to move the worker from task to task as priorities change.

Agreeing working practices and location is none of the above.

[dsc]

To come back to the original question

Either walk away, or give great interview then say that that's how you work - and/or request for the autonomy to determine your working location to go into your contract.

I've done this before, and it's been fine other than causing the odd bit of recreational outrage from the 'crabs in a bucket' types.

Isn't the requirement to be in the office constantly kind of Direction and Control? I get that if you are needed to talk to clients etc. then fine, if the tech set up is so that you cannot get access from outside - also fine, but just to be there, bum in seat?

I'm sure that if you have some truly niche skills, then if you say "feck off, I'm fully remote", then you will be. If there's a long line of others to replace you, tough luck.

[northernladuk]

To come back to the original question

Either walk away, or give great interview then say that that's how you work - and/or request for the autonomy to determine your working location to go into your contract.

I've done this before, and it's been fine other than causing the odd bit of recreational outrage from the 'crabs in a bucket' types.

This. It's not hard but looking at the OP's posts he appears to be a bit too self entitled to work it out. He's expecting everything from the client and can't understand why they won't give him it so I think his over judgement is clouding his ability to deal with a fairly simple situation.

[PerfectStorm]

To come back to the original question

How do you deal with "it's a remote contact but... we expect everyone in the office"

Either walk away, or give great interview then say that that's how you work - and/or request for the autonomy to determine your working location to go into your contract.

I've done this before, and it's been fine other than causing the odd bit of recreational outrage from the 'crabs in a bucket' types.

[eek]

'tractor I worked with a couple years back took a long lunch (1.5 hours) to interview for another contract, and got scolded for taking too long for lunch by a permie (same job equivalent, not a manager).

Sealed the deal on taking said role, as he hadn't been sure if he really wanted to move or not.
Not that the client or the permie cared I'm sure.

Depends on the size of the team. I'm often a one man band because of the nature of the project and the fact I can more than adequately perform all the main roles (Architect / Functional / Dev)...

In my case the permie did care because she was a PM and on the Thursday she was given the project to finish off with little budget left and no developer...

[jmo21]

I do find when things start to get petty it is time to move on.

'tractor I worked with a couple years back took a long lunch (1.5 hours) to interview for another contract, and got scolded for taking too long for lunch by a permie (same job equivalent, not a manager).

Sealed the deal on taking said role, as he hadn't been sure if he really wanted to move or not.
Not that the client or the permie cared I'm sure.

[hugebrain]

On the quiet- not quality time…

I thought it was short for cutey or as the French say LHOOQ

[eek]

If he was on some QT, I hardly think he’d take your call about a computing problem. Not exactly romantic…

On the quiet- not quality time…

[hugebrain]

Only had that once - why were you on your phone?

Because I was getting my mate to help out and fix your problem which given the fact he was going it on the QT

If he was on some QT, I hardly think he’d take your call about a computing problem. Not exactly romantic…

[northernladuk]

That’s a delicious story… tell us what happened next?

He finished it off with 'Nice rack luv now make me a coffee' and got walked off site.

[PerfectStorm]

Once got in the office to have the Project Manager have a go at me for seemingly not doing anything while working from home the day before. Let her finish then told her to go and find the e-mail where we agreed I wasn't working that day.

That’s a delicious story… tell us what happened next?

[SussexSeagull]

Only had that once - why were you on your phone?

Because I was getting my mate to help out and fix your problem which given the fact he was going it on the QT meant I couldn't talk to him except via my phone.

PS he's my resignation - I'm generous I'll stay until Friday....

I do find when things start to get petty it is time to move on.