Montpelier DTA scheme bulletin

[TheFaQQer]

HMRC have now admitted that the NICs can't be collected due to the 1980 limitation act.

Is the argument that NICs aren't a tax or duty?

s37 2(a) says that that Limitation Act does not apply in "any proceedings by the Crown for the recovery of any tax or duty or interest on any tax or duty", so is the argument that NICs are none of those and therefore the act applies?

Edit

I guess it must be - the Chancellor announced in 2016 and 2017 that the limit would be removed from April 2018. More info here.

[BrilloPad]

Is the argument that NICs aren't a tax or duty?

s37 2(a) says that that Limitation Act does not apply in "any proceedings by the Crown for the recovery of any tax or duty or interest on any tax or duty", so is the argument that NICs are none of those and therefore the act applies?

Edit

I guess it must be - the Chancellor announced in 2016 and 2017 that the limit would be removed from April 2018. More info here.

I believe you are wrong(happy to be proved otherwise).

https://forums.contractoruk.com/hmrc...ml#post2521607

Effectively HMRC selectively quoted from the rulebook. Criminal behaviour.

[webberg]

Is it not the fact that NIC is applied by virtue of a separate piece of legislation and as, in theory, the purpose is to swell the National Insurance Fund, i.e. it's a levy, then the Limitation Act applies to impose a deadline.

Tax is a charge on income or profit etc and is subject to its own rules?

Certainly some of our clients have been contacted by HMRC and advised that they may have paid NIC in error and that they will refund if asked. On the other hand if you want to leave that voluntary payment with us....

[BrilloPad]

Is it not the fact that NIC is applied by virtue of a separate piece of legislation and as, in theory, the purpose is to swell the National Insurance Fund, i.e. it's a levy, then the Limitation Act applies to impose a deadline.

Tax is a charge on income or profit etc and is subject to its own rules?

Certainly some of our clients have been contacted by HMRC and advised that they may have paid NIC in error and that they will refund if asked. On the other hand if you want to leave that voluntary payment with us....

As above, I know others who get a cheque with no letter. And others who applied that turned down.

All taxpayers treated equally?

This is a CRIMINAL deliberate mistake.

[nearlyover]

What's the exact wording I should use when writing to HMRC about this? I definitely paid Class 4 NICs as part of the settlement - is there some link or template letter I can use? At the minute I'd be blindly quoting "NICS/LA1980 means you owe me a refund" which doesn't demonstrate I know what I'm talking about (accurate)

[centurian]

Odd. I thought you could still pursue debt which is statute barred under the Limitation Act - just that a court wouldn't allow you to enforce it.

And if you are paid - you definitely don't have to give it back. So I am surprised that HMRC are issuing refunds on the basis of the Limitation Act.

I'm probably missing some detail though.

[webberg]

Odd. I thought you could still pursue debt which is statute barred under the Limitation Act - just that a court wouldn't allow you to enforce it.

And if you are paid - you definitely don't have to give it back. So I am surprised that HMRC are issuing refunds on the basis of the Limitation Act.

I'm probably missing some detail though.

It's not a debt in the sense of a loan. It's a duty or levy that has to be charged within a given period in order to be valid.

Don't confuse this with a loan where the statute of limitation begins at the point the money is demanded to be repaid and ends 6 years after that if the lender has not executed their rights.

[webberg]

What's the exact wording I should use when writing to HMRC about this? I definitely paid Class 4 NICs as part of the settlement - is there some link or template letter I can use? At the minute I'd be blindly quoting "NICS/LA1980 means you owe me a refund" which doesn't demonstrate I know what I'm talking about (accurate)

PM me.

I'll give you an email address.

Once I've run some checks on you, I'll give you some words.

[IH8GordonB]

Read this...

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-man...anual/nim17605

How much clearer do HMRC need to make this to themselves???

To attempt to collect NIC once it has been written off by the Limitation Act surely amounts to an attempt to defraud the taxpayer!

[webberg]

Read this...

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-man...anual/nim17605

How much clearer do HMRC need to make this to themselves???

To attempt to collect NIC once it has been written off by the Limitation Act surely amounts to an attempt to defraud the taxpayer!

In my view this is more cock up than conspiracy.

A sad reflection that the tax knowledge in HMRC is declining at a horrifying rate and blind obedience to process and procedure is what we get.