Terrorists have arrived

[dazza12]

AtW: And what were the crusades a reaction against?

It depends on which of the crusades you are referring to. There were several crusades, each for separate reasons.

But then we get into a deep debate about Cathars, Heresy, Catholocism, Emporer Constantine, Sangreal etc. That could end up being an even longer thread than 'Columbian Hostages'.

[threaded]

AtW: In the crusades many of the locals did help. They didn't like to be invaded and pushed off their land you know.

So pop quiz: who was it who invaded and took Jerusalem in 1076?

[Not So Wise]

They were a defensive operation of cristianity in response to the growth of Islam in the middle east.

Problem though was it untaken by the nobles of westen Europe for entirely selfish and greedy reasons.

And the actions they took then during each of the crusades in the name of christianity have stained it for ever more, not because they did in the name of cristianty but because the church turned a blind eye to the actions of it's "defenders"

[Not So Wise]

So pop quiz: who was it who invaded and took Jerusalem in 1076?

Turkish and Bedouin muslims
Next question
Who did they take it from?
Hint: Was not the Christians

[threaded]

Ah ha, the defenders were worse than the attackers?

Can you give me a reference somewhere to that?

[Not So Wise]

Nope attackers were a lot worse than the defenders.
But then the cristians got hold of it in 1099 and were the worst of the lot combined

More info here
http://www.al-bushra.org/America/ap1.html

[Chico]

I am sickened, disgusted, embarrassed, shocked at the level of ignorance, naivety, confusion about the Islamic threat we face.

They will blow Westerners whether they went to war in Iraq/Afghanistan or not so the idiotic deluded peaceniks who try to excuse this behaviour are pathetic. Lets hope none of your families or friends are lying in morgues tonight.

[threaded]

Gosh, and there wasn't even oil.

[Not So Wise]

They will blow Westerners whether they went to war in Iraq/Afghanistan or not

You are actually correct, some (many) would have been still fighting us because of the continued support of the west for Isreal and it's occupation of arab territories.

Now if there had been no war in Iraq and no support of Isreal you would be incorrect (barring your odd looney bin muslim, but then all religions have them Chico as your yourself are proof)

Notice i did not include Afganistan? thats because i consider that a semi reasonable response to Arab actions, if the government there had not openly aided Bin Ladin after 9/11 they would never have been invaded

[AtW]

You are actually correct, some (many) would have been still fighting us because of the continued support of the west for Isreal and it's occupation of arab territories.

Continued one-sided support of USA - perhaps, not Europe which has more balanced approach, and certainly not UK.