A third of Poles driven home by recession

[Cyberman]

I think you will find that the Poles who have come here contribute a lot more to the economy than they take out.

I find it astonishing that you assume that people who are not British (johnny foreigner) who come here, only do so to screw the benefits system. Does it not occur to you that these people have been to something called a school and then a place called a "University" and that they are not heathen scroungers but people like you (that's about the only similarity) who want to find opportunities to work and get on in life?

I'm not saying that they are here to screw the benefits system, but if they lose their jobs after a year, they will consider their options. If they can get five times the amount on benefits here than they would get if unemployed in Poland, commonsense says that they will stay here. In those circumstances, yes, I do assume that they will stay.

Only a naive Labour government assumes that they would all go home. If just a fifth of those stay it would mean approx. 100,000 extra people claiming the dole that we can ill-afford. If they all stay, God help us !!!

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Aye, It gets even worse when you start adding other European countries into the figures... Like Poland for example.

I see what you did there

[Cyberman]

One wonders why Cyber tory mentions Eire (which would not be in UK governemnt estimates). Is it to make a stronger yet eroneous point?
Sounds like BNP tactics

'
Professor Krystyna Iglicka, a senior adviser to the Warsaw Government, told The Daily Telegraph 400,000 of the 1.2million Poles in Britain and Ireland are expected to lose their jobs by next year as the downturn starts to bite.'



That paragraph is why I mentioned it, you ignoramus!!!!!!

[TimberWolf]

My Grandad was born in the early 1900s, if he didn't work he didn't eat and he lived through some of the worst economic times and 2 world wars. He would be shocked by the attitude of people today who can't be arsed to work because benefits are too high.

I have a mate who's a Pole in a crap UK job, he thinks English people are lazy. He's right, his company can't get the staff. He's reliable and a hard worker , so they made him a manager on not so bad terms.

Poverty was rife in those days and I hardly think you'd want those days to return. Unskilled work was probably relatively more valued than it is today too. Which is my main point - low paid work should be more valued, not paid at a fraction of the wages of other non-work public sector jobs, or jobs filled by the million with immigration distorting its true value to society and limiting aspirations.

When speaking to your Polish friend you are getting the opinion someone that has had the gumption to travel to another country with a view to work, not the work ethic of Poles generally. Poles also have the option of returning or retiring back home with a lump of cash if things don't work out.

[Cyberman]

Poverty was rife in those days and I hardly think you'd want those days to return. Unskilled work was probably relatively more valued than it is today too. Which is my main point - low paid work should be more valued, not paid at a fraction of the wages of other non-work public sector jobs, or jobs filled by the million with immigration distorting its true value to society and limiting aspirations.

When speaking to your Polish friend you are getting the opinion someone that has had the gumption to travel to another country with a view to work, not the work ethic of Poles generally. Poles also have the option of returning or retiring back home with a lump of cash if things don't work out.

Poles are also willing to work for less than the minimum wage. UK residents may also be willing, but have unfortunate overheads such as mortgages and families to raise. Thus, they would rather draw benefits, and I for one do not blame them for using the system to benefit their families. I blame HMG for creating this culture.

[Bagpuss]

'
Professor Krystyna Iglicka, a senior adviser to the Warsaw Government, told The Daily Telegraph 400,000 of the 1.2million Poles in Britain and Ireland are expected to lose their jobs by next year as the downturn starts to bite.'



That paragraph is why I mentioned it, you ignoramus!!!!!!

Originally Posted by Cyberman
Sorry, but I am sceptical to say the least. After HMG stated that only 13,000 would arrive we share 1.2 MILLION official Polish immigrants with Eire.

HMG estimates are for the UK
Eire is not part of the UK so what relevance do they have to the estimate?

Why not add another random European country?

[DodgyAgent]

I'm not saying that they are here to screw the benefits system, but if they lose their jobs after a year, they will consider their options. If they can get five times the amount on benefits here than they would get if unemployed in Poland, commonsense says that they will stay here. In those circumstances, yes, I do assume that they will stay.

Only a naive Labour government assumes that they would all go home. If just a fifth of those stay it would mean approx. 100,000 extra people claiming the dole that we can ill-afford. If they all stay, God help us !!!

Well they are going home because actually they want to work, they dont want benefits they want work. This is exactly how a labour market should work. There should be serious competition at both ends. For employers there should be plenty of choice to pick their workers from, and for workers there should be plenty of choice of where they work.

Employers and employees work far more efficiently if they have to compete in the labour market. "Protecting" jobs from competition is of no use to anyone.

[DodgyAgent]

Poles are also willing to work for less than the minimum wage. UK residents may also be willing, .

That is a myth. It is illegal and a different part of a different argument

[ratewhore]

That article means nothing without AtW's comments...

[The Lone Gunman]

Employers and employees work far more efficiently if they have to compete in the labour market. "Protecting" jobs from competition is of no use to anyone.

That is not strictly true though is it. The competition is unfair when one employee has significantly less costs to meet. Not just talking poles here. The global economy has been set up in favour of the employer/business as he can produce in the lowest cost country but the worker/consumer is restricted to buying his goods and services locally.
You know this argument and where it goes Dodge.