Robbed of Role Models

[d000hg]

I don't think that is actually the case, for the majority at least. Few would deny men and women are different; it's inequality that's the issue.

The majority don't use the term toxic masculinity in the first place. Most of us know these things but more and more are afraid to say it for fear of chastisement by the very vocal minority.

[northernladuk]

I don't think that is actually the case, for the majority at least. Few would deny men and women are different; it's inequality that's the issue.

True but you can't make equality where there are biological differences. You can work and do your best but in general men like things, women like people. Very very simplistic but if that's the base to work from you can't normalise quality in certain areas if it's just not in their make up. You can give opportunity affirmative action and all sorts but it just won't be equal in some areas. Nursing and caring will be dominated by women, engineering etc by men. It's fundamental. Give anyone the opportunity to work in that area for sure but to try drive it to equality is madness.

That said I think we are getting off the topic of toxic masculinity and in to gender equality which are pretty different things.

[Zigenare]

Quite.

Take SE's own example. She has asserted that mountain rescue is the sort of thing you'd predominantly expect to see staffed by men, and men of a somewhat specific type - which isn't controversial. But if we then even hinted it's role better suited to men, you'd be called a misogynistic dinosaur.

And?

The majority don't use the term toxic masculinity in the first place. Most of us know these things but more and more are afraid to say it for fear of chastisement by the very vocal minority.

I'm not afraid, are you?

[vetran]

The reality is that good role models for minorities and women are just not written IMHO.

We have Shaft & Arabella.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episod...ay-destroy-you

Yet the best selling musical was the lion king. Aladdin & Mulan were great hits.

Idris Elba is doing great work as are Will Smith & Wesley Snipes. They are all a natural pick for lead roles.

Plenty of people are willing to see variety in the white middle class male as a hero. We just need to write parts for them, not try to morph existing roles to fit.

There must be hundreds if not millions of stories from Africa, there must be plenty of stories where cultures have interfaced that is a core of early Jeffery Archer novels. You could write about when the Kings met the Greeks, Arabs, then the Spanish/Portuguese etc. The tales of hunting in Africa etc. Tales of adjusting to new cultures.

Already we have East is East, bend it like Beckham and many more great movies about such interactions.


Strange rescuing those in peril upon the sea has a few heroines

https://finisterre.com/blogs/broadca...men-of-the-sea

strange not in the list of blockbusters?

[d000hg]

Is Wesley Snipes considered a good role model?

[d000hg]

I'm not afraid, are you?

I have little interaction with such people and am fortunate to be in a position where they have little influence over my life. Many don't have that luxury of saying what they think without consequence.

I saw Brian May speak out against the decision to scrap Best Male/Female music awards over the weekend. I didn't see the full story but it will have caused substantial backlash, he has no financial concerns but even so may find himself blacklisted from many venues.

[vetran]

Is Wesley Snipes considered a good role model?

Who wouldn't want to be a half vampire super hero?

[Whorty]

True but you can't make equality where there are biological differences. You can work and do your best but in general men like things, women like people. Very very simplistic but if that's the base to work from you can't normalise quality in certain areas if it's just not in their make up. You can give opportunity affirmative action and all sorts but it just won't be equal in some areas. Nursing and caring will be dominated by women, engineering etc by men. It's fundamental. Give anyone the opportunity to work in that area for sure but to try drive it to equality is madness.

That said I think we are getting off the topic of toxic masculinity and in to gender equality which are pretty different things.

Wow ... someone's taken a time slip back to the 1950s!

There is a shortage of male carers, they are in demand. But men are told that it's not a career for them (and the pay is sh*t). Just like women are still told that certain careers are not for them.

As for men like things, women like people ... where did that come from? I know at least one woman who likes my thing more than even I do

[SueEllen]

Wow ... someone's taken a time slip back to the 1950s!

There is a shortage of male carers, they are in demand. But men are told that it's not a career for them (and the pay is sh*t). Just like women are still told that certain careers are not for them.

As for men like things, women like people ... where did that come from? I know at least one woman who likes my thing more than even I do

Agreed there are plenty of male nurses from developing countries likewise most female engineers also come from developing countries.

I can't think why when these countries societies are so unequal can you? They all must have different biology....

[northernladuk]

Wow ... someone's taken a time slip back to the 1950s!

There is a shortage of male carers, they are in demand. But men are told that it's not a career for them (and the pay is sh*t). Just like women are still told that certain careers are not for them.

As for men like things, women like people ... where did that come from? I know at least one woman who likes my thing more than even I do

I don't think it's me that's taken a trip back. Men are not told that at all anymore, nor any other gender. There is more affirmative action to boost the gender dominate roles than ever. Dunno where you've been hiding.

As for the men/women thing, it's been very heavily investigated and documented for many many years. We are different biologically for a start and there is clear evidence genders gravitate to different things in all areas of life. Granted it is generalised because it's not black and white but it's definitely there. Just because you don't have a clue doesn't mean it doesn't come from somewhere and there is factual evidence of it.

I know one person that used to be a man and is now a woman? Does that mean all men will become women? Does it buggery. Just because you know one person that doesn't strictly conform it doesn't mean everyone else does.

I'd stop drinking at lunch time if I were you.