Covid - actually Boris may emerge as vaguely competent.

[vetran]

But many of the countries near us on the list are far less affluent and do not have our health/medical/science infrastructure. Poland for instance was a long way behind but then had a dreadful wave and caught up quickly while we were vaccinating.

Which is why I quote France & Italy who are comparable.

[ladymuck]

We do a heck of a lot of testing and sequence a really high proportion (I think I read it was 50% but could be misremembering) of positive tests to determine the variant. Germany now sequence less than 1% of positive results so they have hardly any idea what variants are doing the rounds.

It was in the torygraph the other day. Will try and dig out a link.

[d000hg]

Which is why I quote France & Italy who are comparable.

Italy is not really comparable. Their health service was overwhelmed in the first wave which is the worst case scenario where you get more deaths, and yet until vaccinations we were far worse off than them. And they're not really in the same league economically or infrastructure-wise.

France still has a lower death rate than the UK, even after their 3rd wave - which we missed. I don't think they are going to catch us up and when we consider how many tens of thousands of lives the vaccines saved, it's a big disparity.

We do have Belgium, but they seem to be the outlier really. It is curious why we were so hard hit despite a quite obedient population and good health service.

[vetran]

Italy is not really comparable. Their health service was overwhelmed in the first wave which is the worst case scenario where you get more deaths, and yet until vaccinations we were far worse off than them. And they're not really in the same league economically or infrastructure-wise.

France still has a lower death rate than the UK, even after their 3rd wave - which we missed. I don't think they are going to catch us up and when we consider how many tens of thousands of lives the vaccines saved, it's a big disparity.

We do have Belgium, but they seem to be the outlier really. It is curious why we were so hard hit despite a quite obedient population and good health service.

Financially, medically & socially Belgium, Germany, France & Italy are comparable to the UK. I accept Eastern European countries may lag our wealth and social provision so may not be a good fit.

Italy's experience in COVID is partially due to their decisions on how to manage it. Which is what we are discussing, BOJO could have sat back and allowed it to overwhelm the NHS he thankfully didn't.

If you look at deaths per 1 million of population France is at 1,678 and UK at 1,836 so about 10,000 more deaths before France overtakes us. Their vaccination levels are well below us.

Belgium has already overtaken us.

[AtW]

150k dead and counting, that's not competent, even vaguely.

Competent is what China did (and they had a lot less time for it), Australia, New Zealand.

Boris should get 150k consecutive life terms (in prison) for his management.

[vetran]

150k dead and counting, that's not competent, even vaguely.

Competent is what China did (and they had a lot less time for it), Australia, New Zealand.

Boris should get 150k consecutive life terms (in prison) for his management.

well as it is 127K with Covid as the cause he has already exceeded your expectations.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths

[AtW]

well as it is 127K with Covid as the cause he has already exceeded your expectations.

https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/deaths

I'll accept reduction of his sentence to 127k consecutive life terms

[vetran]

I'll accept reduction of his sentence to 127k consecutive life terms

So can we jail Macaroon for 109k life sentences?

[mookiemoo]

As more and more data comes out, it actually looks like lock downs and responses have very little effect on the progress of the virus unless you are an Aus or New Zealand

comparison of the states in the US that took harder measures versus those with a leave it up to the individual method - the outcomes are roughly the same

At the end of the day viruses do what they do and you'll still end up with the same amount of dead at the end of it - it just changes whether it happens quickly or whether you drag it out

[AtW]

As more and more data comes out, it actually looks like lock downs and responses have very little effect on the progress of the virus unless you are an Aus or New Zealand

Without lockdowns we'd be looking at 500k+ dead plus, at least, far more with "long Covid" - lockdowns did their job to get to vaccination stage, would have lost a lot less people if cretin Boris locked down earlier.