J Corbyn and Iain Duncan Smith...

**ladymuck** · 2 April 2021, 08:47

Sadly for my mental wellbeing, I am on their side too.

**AtW** · 2 April 2021, 08:56

Perhaps calling them Covid Ausweis would be acceptable?

**malvolio** · 2 April 2021, 09:23

The objection is apparently that it could lead to discrimination against certain groups. Such as brain dead failed politicians, perhaps?

**ladymuck** · 2 April 2021, 09:31

I've said it on other threads. You can't discriminate what parts of society a vaxxed / non-vaxxed person is allowed to engage with. It's just fundamentally wrong in my opinion.

If venues control numbers and spacing between patrons, with masks worn, then there should be none of this nonsense going on. How long would they expect to keep it up for? This virus isn't going away. It's a shameful proposition.

**mattster** · 2 April 2021, 09:57

Any sort of general vaccine requirements introduced before every single person in the country has had the chance to get the jab would be grossly unfair. The youngest have already put their lives on hold/lost their jobs/education etc, largely to protect the oldies, despite themselves being at much reduced risk. If they then have to stand to one side and watch these same oldies living it up down the boozer with their vaccine certificates whilst they themselves are still waiting for their chance to get jabbed, then I'd expect (and hope for) a revolution - or perhaps a bit of civil disobedience.
I'm not against vaccine requirements for certain jobs - the obvious ones, like care and health - but again, only after the vaccine has been offered.

**malvolio** · 2 April 2021, 10:01

Originally posted by ladymuck View Post

I've said it on other threads. You can't discriminate what parts of society a vaxxed / non-vaxxed person is allowed to engage with. It's just fundamentally wrong in my opinion.

If venues control numbers and spacing between patrons, with masks worn, then there should be none of this nonsense going on. How long would they expect to keep it up for? This virus isn't going away. It's a shameful proposition.

Yes, it's discriminatory to exclude from your vicinity someone who is likely to infect you with a nasty disease. Some kinds of discrimination may be thought to be justifiable.

I'm not saying it's right or that the proposed system is fair or reasonable; it isn't.. But attack it for its real failings, if you can identify them, not on the basis of some screwed up concept of fairness.

**ladymuck** · 2 April 2021, 10:19

Originally posted by malvolio View Post

Yes, it's discriminatory to exclude from your vicinity someone who is likely to infect you with a nasty disease. Some kinds of discrimination may be thought to be justifiable.

I'm not saying it's right or that the proposed system is fair or reasonable; it isn't.. But attack it for its real failings, if you can identify them, not on the basis of some screwed up concept of fairness.

In that case, why select one disease that has a vaccine? Why not all diseases that we have vaccines for?

Do you refuse to socialise with people who don't have the flu vaccine every year? What about yellow fever, HepC, MMR, polio, small pox?

What exactly will you deem acceptable for a non-vaccinated person to be allowed to do? So you're happy to walk around a supermarket with them in the same space but not sit in a pub garden? Are they allowed to get a haircut? Should be they banned from attending the doctor's surgery?

Where do you think the line should be drawn as to how much you exclude a person because they haven't been vaccinated?

You also haven't even given reference to how long this awful proposal should be in force for. The virus is mutating all the time, the vaccines will become ineffective and will need to be reformulated so do you then start checking exactly which variant a person has been vaccinated against and discriminate according to that?

It's an utter nonsense from start to finish and it's you who mentioned fairness, I never did. I said it was wrong.

**AtW** · 2 April 2021, 10:26

Originally posted by ladymuck View Post

You can't discriminate what parts of society a vaxxed / non-vaxxed person is allowed to engage with. It's just fundamentally wrong in my opinion.

It's fundamentally right because those who choose to refuse vaccine can't expect to put others at risk, shame about those who can't get it for medical reasons but tough - being able to go to pub isn't exactly a human right.

**AtW** · 2 April 2021, 10:27

Originally posted by mattster View Post

Any sort of general vaccine requirements introduced before every single person in the country has had the chance to get the jab would be grossly unfair.

Many businesses might not last that long, they need revenues right now, what's the problem of having to wait a few months before being able to visit pubs which will be far safer due to vaccine requirement?

J Corbyn and Iain Duncan Smith...