In or Out?

[Troll]

My view is biased as we have property in Spain, and I guess it will easier to flit between here and there while we are part of the EU, which is why an undecided sways to a stay in.

Did Brits not have property in Spain before 1975?

[DaveB]

DaveB - I am like indecisive Dave from the fast show. Give me a good argument to stay in and I will wobble like FLC on a plate... I get the upheaval that leaving would create but I think the money we waste on the EU will help to cover us. Lots more public sector jobs to be had as well if we make the move, think of the contracts that would be created!

Corporations will still take the cheapest path to resource projects and if that means bringing in overseas workers, they will. All it will do is create more bureaucracy, costs will be passed onto the end clients.

Can't see any reason why more PS jobs would suddenly appear, especially given the current Governments commitment to cut public sector spending.

It will do nothing to address the issue of Non-EU migrants arriving. It won't suddenly make all those poor bastards in Calais disappear or stop them trying to get here.

It will make life harder for UK nationals who want to live or work in Europe.

It will make life harder for UK companies wanting to do business in Europe and reduce the Governments ability to lobby on behalf of UK PLC in Europe. Example - Norway is already in this situation. They are not part of the EU, but in order to sell to EU countries they still have to abide by EU regulations. They have no say over what these might be and no influence to change them if they are found to be excessive.

Yes we would save money through not contributing to the budget, but this relies on the money saved being reallocated back to those areas that actually get cash from Europe, especially in science and technology research where we get more back from the EU in grants than we contribute. The UK has a terrible track record of investing in this area and I have no confidence the money would be spent here rather than simply being trousered by the government and squandered elsewhere.

[barrydidit]

I thought an out vote would be that - out. No negotiations. Or do you mean negotiations in terms of how hard they want to bend us over for being quitters and trying to mess with their utopian super-power dream?

I reckon it's the kick up the arse they (politicians) all need to start talking about meaningful reform. If we vote 'in' it's just an endorsement of the status quo. We know from past experience that countries will be forced to keep voting till the 'right' answer is given, so why not call their bluff and start proper discussions from a strong "we have a mandate to leave unless you actually start to sort your tulip out" position.

[Lockhouse]

It's about sovereignty. That's what we fought two World Wars for. Anyone voting in deserves everything that will inevitably follow.

[scooterscot]

It's about sovereignty. That's what we fought two World Wars for. Anyone voting in deserves everything that will inevitably follow.

You've never lost it!

[administrator]

You've never lost it!

Isn't the fact that we have laws foisted upon us without the ability to say no a complete lack of it?

[seanraaron]

Out. Then we can start the negotiations proper.

You think we'd be able to opt-out of the eurozone if so? If the EU fails under the strain of the migrant crisis I expect it to be replaced with something more robust and not just EEA Mark 2. I can't see people near the Russian border being satisfied hiding behind a free trade agreement.

[scooterscot]

Isn't the fact that we have laws foisted upon us without the ability to say no a complete lack of it?

No different than any other EU state. The UK is not alone in the un-happyness.

The Italians are a good example of changing the EU where it suits them. A law is thrust upon them and they ignore it if it does not suit them.

[scooterscot]

You think we'd be able to opt-out of the eurozone if so? If the EU fails under the strain of the migrant crisis I expect it to be replaced with something more robust and not just EEA Mark 2. I can't see people near the Russian border being satisfied hiding behind a free trade agreement.

What happens then if the skilled Syrians (not all feckless refugees you know) fill the much needed skilled jobs Germany has to offer and therefore increases their economic wallop after the UK buggers off?

[administrator]

No different than any other EU state. The UK is not alone in the un-happyness.

The Italians are a good example of changing the EU where it suits them. A law is thrust upon them and they ignore it if it does not suit them.

We don't have the attitude of the Italians though