How long will rofl harris get?

[northernladuk]

Out of interest how do they get hard evidence in cases like this, and Saville's? You can prove beyond reasonable doubt the accuser was in a room alone with the defendant and have people come forward saying they were told at the time, etc, but to be found guilty don't you need more than that? We're presumably not talking people keeping jizz-stained cloths for decades... porn is easier to see but abuse from decades ago? There's no way I could remember the fine details of something that happened when I was 7, all I could say is "he abused me" but not know the day or the exact place.

Not specific to either of these cases - general question?

I've always wondered this. Historic cases must be a nightmare to prove or defend. I can't remember where I was last week let alone decades ago.

I so wanted this not to be true and he was innocent. He's been proved guilty so not going to defend him or argue he didn't do it. I just didn't want it to be true.

[vwdan]

Out of interest how do they get hard evidence in cases like this, and Saville's? You can prove beyond reasonable doubt the accuser was in a room alone with the defendant and have people come forward saying they were told at the time, etc, but to be found guilty don't you need more than that? We're presumably not talking people keeping jizz-stained cloths for decades... porn is easier to see but abuse from decades ago? There's no way I could remember the fine details of something that happened when I was 7, all I could say is "he abused me" but not know the day or the exact place.

Not specific to either of these cases - general question?

They don't and have to rely on good old fashioned non-forensic evidence, whether it be corroboration or a pattern. As an aside, here's the sentencing remarks:

http://www.judiciary.gov.uk/wp-conte...r-v-harris.pdf

[SueEllen]

Also, more women have been coming forward to make allegations against him, so it's entirely possible he'll be up on trial again and get a few more years tacked on the end.

I hope they send him back to Oz especially as one witness from Oz came forward and gave evidence in London.

[mudskipper]

Out of interest how do they get hard evidence in cases like this, and Saville's? You can prove beyond reasonable doubt the accuser was in a room alone with the defendant and have people come forward saying they were told at the time, etc, but to be found guilty don't you need more than that? We're presumably not talking people keeping jizz-stained cloths for decades... porn is easier to see but abuse from decades ago? There's no way I could remember the fine details of something that happened when I was 7, all I could say is "he abused me" but not know the day or the exact place.

Not specific to either of these cases - general question?

Two unconnected victims describing the same modus operandi?

[speling bee]

Out of interest how do they get hard evidence in cases like this, and Saville's? You can prove beyond reasonable doubt the accuser was in a room alone with the defendant and have people come forward saying they were told at the time, etc, but to be found guilty don't you need more than that? We're presumably not talking people keeping jizz-stained cloths for decades... porn is easier to see but abuse from decades ago? There's no way I could remember the fine details of something that happened when I was 7, all I could say is "he abused me" but not know the day or the exact place.

Not specific to either of these cases - general question?

Many crimes are decided through one person's word against another and eye witness statements, and before forensics, that's pretty much how all things were decided unless caught red-handed.

But 12 men and women good and true (was it unanimous?) listened to the evidence and decided that he was guilty beyond all reasonable doubt.

Some key factors that are commonly found in miscarriages of justice (forensics and confessions) were missing in this case.

[SueEllen]

Two unconnected victims describing the same modus operandi?

Writing a letter saying you had an "affair" with a child that was under age?

[mudskipper]

Those who want the details can read the judge's sentencing remarks here (PDF): http://www.judiciary.gov.uk/wp-conte...r-v-harris.pdf

Oops - they left 'C's name in there.

[d000hg]

Two unconnected victims describing the same modus operandi?

That sounds like enough to start a case on, not to end it. "Beyond reasonable doubt" requires much more than a bunch of people all claiming they were abused, surely? OK if they all independently claim some specific detail like he stuck is willy in their left ear, or remember he had a mole shaped like a kangaroo on his arse, but it seems unlikely.

I'm not saying the cases aren't correct but just wondering how they get convincing evidence -this is a man's life so a bunch of people claiming something isn't enough IMO. If I found some event he'd been at when I was 8 and claimed he abused me, do they even keep records of every person there that day?

[NickFitz]

Oops - they left 'C's name in there.

Yes, I noticed that. I assume somebody will be getting a severe bollocking for that.

[vwdan]

That sounds like enough to start a case on, not to end it. "Beyond reasonable doubt" requires much more than a bunch of people all claiming they were abused, surely? OK if they all independently claim some specific detail like he stuck is willy in their left ear, or remember he had a mole shaped like a kangaroo on his arse, but it seems unlikely.

I'm not saying the cases aren't correct but just wondering how they get convincing evidence -this is a man's life so a bunch of people claiming something isn't enough IMO. If I found some event he'd been at when I was 8 and claimed he abused me, do they even keep records of every person there that day?

Bear in mind that the defence had the opportunity to cross examine and question the witnesses - something which they do most robustly