Opt out of Conduct of employment agencies 2003 act?

[northernladuk]

Wooooooooo! Look at this...

A contract on the REC site for contractor Opted in!! It's a word document BTW

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct...42080656,d.d2k

Check these little gems out as well....

Page 4.. which we kinda know but nice to see

6.3 Subject to clauses 6.4 and 6.5 the Employment Business shall pay the Contractor for all hours worked regardless of whether the Employment Business has received payment from the Client for those hours.

Note: The Conduct Regulations 2003 require you to give an undertaking to pay the worker for hours actually worked whether or not payment has been received from the Client. If the worker is unable to produce a signed timesheet but there is no dispute that the worker actually worked the hours that s/he is claiming for you must pay him but you may delay payment in order to make enquiries to confirm that s/he did in fact work those hours,

Page 5 - An interesting one..

8.4 If before the first Assignment, during the course of an Assignment or within the Relevant Period the Client wishes to employ the Contractor direct or through another employment business, the Contractor acknowledges that the Employment Business will be entitled either to charge the Client a fee or to agree an extension of the hiring period with the Client at the end of which the Contractor may be engaged directly by the Client or through another employment business without further charge to the Client. In addition the Employment Business will be entitled to charge a fee to the Client if the Client introduces the Contractor to a third party who subsequently engages the Contractor within the Relevant Period.

Note: Clause re temp to perm agreement with client: To ensure that a Contractor is aware of any agreement with a client the REC recommends that this clause is inserted into the Contractor’s terms of engagement. Alternatively you may wish to insert it onto your registration form. It is however essential under the REC Code of Practice that this information is given in writing to each worker before s/he is sent on assignment.

Pge 6 - Another interesting note...

9.1 This Agreement shall commence on [insert date] and shall continue until completion of the Contractor Services to the reasonable satisfaction of the Client at which time this Agreement shall expire automatically [*unless previously terminated by the Employment Business or the Contractor giving the other party the period of notice specified in the schedule attached.]

[*NOTE: It is unusual to include a notice period for termination in this kind of contract]

Page 9 - And this little baby right at the end

Under the Conduct of Employment Agencies and Employment Businesses Regulations 2003, which come into force on the 6th April 2004no restriction may be placed on a Contractor from taking up employment direct with a Client. This equally applies to limited company contractors. However limited companies are entitled to opt out of the Regulations provided they give notice to that effect in writing before the start of any assignment and provided they are not being supplied to work with children under 18 or vulnerable adults.

These terms have been drafted on the assumption that the limited company contractor has not opted out of the Regulations and so the restriction clause that was in versions of these terms based on the earlier 1976 Regulations has been taken out.

In any event clauses of this nature, which prevent Contractors from taking up assignments are unlikely to be enforceable in the Courts unless you can show you have a legitimate business interest to protect in doing so. Furthermore where you have received a fee from a client for the engagement this may be viewed as a penalty clause. The better course of action is to discourage the Client from engaging the Contractor by means of an introduction fee. ]

Some very interesting notes in that. From the dealings with the last agent I would say they are pretty much ignoring quite a lot of the information the REC are providing them......

If we could just get access to some of the documents such as the one below it would be a lot easier taking Opt In with difficult agents.

The Recruitment & Employment Confederation - Welcome to REC Legal Services

Registering limited company contractors - can I make it a condition of providing work-finding services that a limited company contractor opt out of the Conduct Regulations?

[Wanderer]

Folks, if an agency insists that you must opt out or tells you that they only take "opted out" contractors then they are acting illegally. Do your fellow contractors a favour and report the agency to the following organisations:

1. Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate [email protected]
2. REC (if the agency is a member)
3. PCG [email protected] (if you aren't a PCG member, consider joining too)

[cojak]

Opt out of Conduct of employment agencies 2003 act?

Folks, if an agency insists that you must opt out or tells you that they only take "opted out" contractors then they are acting illegally. Do your fellow contractors a favour and report the agency to the following organisations:

1. Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate [email protected]
2. REC (if the agency is a member)
3. PCG [email protected] (if you aren't a PCG member, consider joining too)

Good luck with that, guys.

[psychocandy]

Folks, if an agency insists that you must opt out or tells you that they only take "opted out" contractors then they are acting illegally. Do your fellow contractors a favour and report the agency to the following organisations:

1. Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate [email protected]
2. REC (if the agency is a member)
3. PCG [email protected] (if you aren't a PCG member, consider joining too)

As NLUK pointed out with his recent experiences though. If you kick off and try this the chances are that the following may happen:-

1. You'll lose the gig.
2. EAS won't do bugger all anyway.

All well and good to be right, but I'd rather suck it up and not be benched. Not right perhaps but until the EAS start knocking some heads together it seems pointless kicking up a fuss..

[BolshieBastard]

Interesting info unearthed there NL!

Folks, if an agency insists that you must opt out or tells you that they only take "opted out" contractors then they are acting illegally. Do your fellow contractors a favour and report the agency to the following organisations:

1. Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate [email protected]
2. REC (if the agency is a member)
3. PCG [email protected] (if you aren't a PCG member, consider joining too)

Deffo will be something I'll be looking to do.

As NLUK pointed out with his recent experiences though. If you kick off and try this the chances are that the following may happen:-

1. You'll lose the gig.
2. EAS won't do bugger all anyway.

All well and good to be right, but I'd rather suck it up and not be benched. Not right perhaps but until the EAS start knocking some heads together it seems pointless kicking up a fuss..

But this is what they will expect you to do, to cowtow to them and accept the status quo.

Ask yourself, what is the difference between the agency saying no role if you want to opt in and the client will only pay 200 a day when your minimum rate expectation is 300 a day?

They are both methods to force you into accepting something they dont want to give. People can either roll over and accept what agents say for fear of losing a potential roll or stand their ground. But, if you're frightened of losing a roll for asking for what you want, you may as well become a permie imo.

[BolshieBastard]

Interesting!

Pimp phoned me early today about a role they spoke to me last week about. Pimp works for a large agency but the end client is someone I've never heard of. Turns out they are a smallish company. Hmmm.

So agent says he's sending usual stuff through including the opt out declaration. I say Im opting in for this one thanks. Agent asks why? I state my reasons. Oh, er, I dont know if we can. Why not? Because we havent a single contractor working who is opted in

Anyways, I say Im opting in and later, bigger pimp from same agency phones. Why do you want to opt in? Me, do I have to give a reason? No, says bigger pimp. There you go then, I said.

OK, we'll see if the client will take opted in contractor as they may not want an employee(!). Eh? Opting in doesnt affect the client in any way shape or form I said.

They havent phoned back or sent an opted in declaration. D'ya reckon I've been passed over?

[northernladuk]

Interesting!

Pimp phoned me early today about a role they spoke to me last week about. Pimp works for a large agency but the end client is someone I've never heard of. Turns out they are a smallish company. Hmmm.

So agent says he's sending usual stuff through including the opt out declaration. I say Im opting in for this one thanks. Agent asks why? I state my reasons. Oh, er, I dont know if we can. Why not? Because we havent a single contractor working who is opted in

Anyways, I say Im opting in and later, bigger pimp from same agency phones. Why do you want to opt in? Me, do I have to give a reason? No, says bigger pimp. There you go then, I said.

OK, we'll see if the client will take opted in contractor as they may not want an employee(!). Eh? Opting in doesnt affect the client in any way shape or form I said.

They havent phoned back or sent an opted in declaration. D'ya reckon I've been passed over?

If it is anything like the situation I had they are scrabbling around trying to find out what opting in actually means. Even the 'legal' team at the agency I was speaking to was struggling to put a clear explaination of why I should or shouldn't so sent them the article for Roger Sinclair at Ergos. At that point I informed them I wasn't proceeding so don't know what the final outcome would have been.

I find it kinda throws them a little when they actually find someone who knows what they are talking about. Puts the agent right on the back foot.

EDIT : What does make me giggle is if we do all start opting in we will be oliged to give two references

[BolshieBastard]

If it is anything like the situation I had they are scrabbling around trying to find out what opting in actually means. Even the 'legal' team at the agency I was speaking to was struggling to put a clear explaination of why I should or shouldn't so sent them the article for Roger Sinclair at Ergos. At that point I informed them I wasn't proceeding so don't know what the final outcome would have been.

I find it kinda throws them a little when they actually find someone who knows what they are talking about. Puts the agent right on the back foot.

EDIT : What does make me giggle is if we do all start opting in we will be oliged to give two references

Obviously there was a lot more discussed between the me and the two pimps but dont want to put it on record here. You never know who's reading these threads.

But, I got the impression they thought they could talk me out of it (if the location wasnt a bit tulip, I might have agreed and gone the opt out route).

I was quite surprised at the drivel quoted to me as to why I should opt out.

Thankfully, I have another better paid (by some 35%) iron in the fire so if they do \ have decided to look for other contractors (this is why I think they havent responded, they are looking for someone else), I wont be majorly disappointed.

[Andy Hallett]

Opt out of Conduct of employment agencies 2003 act?

The Regulations are a complete dogs dinner. It is typical of a government that doesn't understand the flexible labour force. The intentions (as I recall) were good, to protect vulnerable workers, the only people who genuinely benefit are the lawyers.

There is a consultation about reform, although I don't hold out much hope.

[SueEllen]

As NLUK pointed out with his recent experiences though. If you kick off and try this the chances are that the following may happen:-

1. You'll lose the gig.
2. EAS won't do bugger all anyway.

All well and good to be right, but I'd rather suck it up and not be benched. Not right perhaps but until the EAS start knocking some heads together it seems pointless kicking up a fuss..

I think one of the issues is the government like doing things by phone and snail mail, and people in IT prefer doing things by email.

I also suspect the email box is unattended as when I contacted the EAS by email a few years ago my email was ignored, however when I used the phone they actually acted - so the agency got a kick up the behind and I didn't lose the gig.

Phone number for all those interested - 0800 917 2368 (Yes it is the same number as the Agency Workers Pay helpline, and you have to give your name and contact details. )