£100m British Steel Loan

[Whorty]

I don't believe I've mentioned conscription.

No, you didn't but John did and I was initially responding to him when you joined the debate. oPM and others have also mentioned conscription multiple times. Its a Project Fear lie.

Possibly, but then any new EU laws that the UK parliament doesn't like, will not need to be followed, e.g. conscription to an EU army, allowing Turkey into the EU, etc, etc.

[JohntheBike]

No, you didn't but John did and I was initially responding to him when you joined the debate. oPM and others have also mentioned conscription multiple times. Its a Project Fear lie.

articles such as this -

France joins Sweden and Lithuania in bringing back mandatory national service — Quartz

and this

Turkey - Conscription for all men over the age of 20. They must serve between six and 15 months. Greece - Compulsory military service (nine months) for men from the age of 19.

are leading some to believe that conscription is an option for any EU army

[Zigenare]

No, you didn't but John did and I was initially responding to him when you joined the debate. oPM and others have also mentioned conscription multiple times. Its a Project Fear lie.

Or ignorance of the facts.

[Whorty]

articles such as this -

France joins Sweden and Lithuania in bringing back mandatory national service — Quartz

and this

Turkey - Conscription for all men over the age of 20. They must serve between six and 15 months. Greece - Compulsory military service (nine months) for men from the age of 19.

are leading some to believe that conscription is an option for any EU army

So what? Other countries have their own laws that are different to the UK ... no surprise there. We have different laws within and across the UK (think NI and abortion) - doesn't mean jack sh1t fella.

And what the hell has Turkey got to do with the EU ... unless you haven't noticed, they're not in the EU

[JohntheBike]

So what? Other countries have their own laws that are different to the UK ... no surprise there. We have different laws within and across the UK (think NI and abortion) - doesn't mean jack sh1t fella.

And what the hell has Turkey got to do with the EU ... unless you haven't noticed, they're not in the EU

if you haven't noticed, the original Treaty of Rome required members states to be essentially Christian. This provision has now been dropped, or is going to be, as far as I understand. So make up your own mind why.

[Whorty]

if you haven't noticed, the original Treaty of Rome required members states to be essentially Christian. This provision has now been dropped, or is going to be, as far as I understand. So make up your own mind why.

Project Fear

Do be a darling and point out exactly where, in the treaty, it mentions that member states are required to be essentially Christian. I've had a quick nose about and can't find it myself.

https://ec.europa.eu/romania/sites/r...de_la_roma.pdf

Edit: 8 hours since I first posted this .... come on John Turnip Head, back up your assertion that the Treaty of Rome requires member states to be Christian. Or was it all just made up tulip?

[Whorty]

Bump for John to come and back up his statement.

[Yorkie62]

Project Fear

Do be a darling and point out exactly where, in the treaty, it mentions that member states are required to be essentially Christian. I've had a quick nose about and can't find it myself.

https://ec.europa.eu/romania/sites/r...de_la_roma.pdf

Edit: 8 hours since I first posted this .... come on John Turnip Head, back up your assertion that the Treaty of Rome requires member states to be Christian. Or was it all just made up tulip?

To be fair is does mention a Christian here on page 3

THE PRESIDENT OF THE FRENCH REPUBLIC:
Mr Christian PINEAU, Minister for Foreign Affairs,
Mr Maurice FAURE, Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs;

I am taking the pee

[JohntheBike]

Project Fear

Do be a darling and point out exactly where, in the treaty, it mentions that member states are required to be essentially Christian. I've had a quick nose about and can't find it myself.

https://ec.europa.eu/romania/sites/r...de_la_roma.pdf

Edit: 8 hours since I first posted this .... come on John Turnip Head, back up your assertion that the Treaty of Rome requires member states to be Christian. Or was it all just made up tulip?

OK carrot, there may not be a specific requirement for member states to be Christian, but the ethos of the EU rests firmly on the foundation of Christianity and as such, there would likely to be resistance from many in power to the dilution of this ethos. However, although I can't find any reference to it, when the possibility of Turkey joining the EU was raised, the ethos of the EU was certainly mentioned, in that it is predominantly a Christian organisation.

Europe's early vision: how Christian Democratic morality shaped the EU | LSE BREXIT

http://www.lse.ac.uk/europeanInstitu...EQSPaper10.pdf

"Thus, the cultural influence and long (though still contested) tradition of humanism within the
historically dominant Christian churches render them more able to exert influence
within the structures established by the Union to engage with religious perspectives
than outsider religions such as Islam which have had less cultural impact on Europe
or which may have more antagonistic attitudes to humanist principles."

and I do go to bed early!

[BlasterBates]

You can always gauge the hopelessness of Brexit according to the extent to which the EU army is debated. In particular debates over conscription.