A Sad “IR35” Day

[PerfectStorm]

Surely if its not in your schedule you are hanging yourself out to dry in regard to IR35. Yes handover completed work but training is quite different ?

I think if you refuse every bit of work that comes your way that isn't strictly within the schedule but nonetheless quite linked to it, you'll have a very short career

[BABABlackSheep]

Is the client actually going to make a determination, or is this client one of those that is making a policy decision not engage with PSCs after Feb 2020 so no determination will be required?

The latter.

[dx4100]

I think if you refuse every bit of work that comes your way that isn't strictly within the schedule but nonetheless quite linked to it, you'll have a very short career

17 year career with 11 years as a contractor would suggest not

[WordIsBond]

Unless you have something in the works, I would ask for a new contract now. I wouldn't bother with fixed price, the client won't get why you are doing that. Same price, same agent, but new contract with new title and new job description -- Training. From now until February.
Insist that the contract states, 'As the contract terminates in February the client will not be making an IR35 determination.'

Mutually agree to terminate the old contract immediately, and begin the new one. The key is to get in a new role, and one that won't be assessed, ASAP. They've opened the door for that. You want to be out of there before April, but the sooner you break with the old role that you've been in for a while, the better. They've given you a way to break off that role without actually stopping your income. Seems like an opportunity, and one that prevents any unpleasant determinations on their part.

edit: I see now, they won't be making any determinations, so you don't have to worry about that. Still, I think the role change allows you to keep earning without significant risk, AND keeps the door open for future work if it all goes pear-shaped for them.

[BABABlackSheep]

edit: I see now, they won't be making any determinations, so you don't have to worry about that. Still, I think the role change allows you to keep earning without significant risk, AND keeps the door open for future work if it all goes pear-shaped for them.

It’s an interesting thought.

I have a contract till Dec, 1 month contractor absence, so that’s an extra 2 months work till End of Feb.

My concern is that come Feb, a contract market that is already saturated will get even worse.

Hoping if I am available immediately I can secure something else. Damn but there’s a lot of applicants out there

[northernladuk]

It might get better with a crap load of roles that people just can't travel for. Gonna be rich pickings for the London crowd when none of the northern people can claim travel for inside gigs.

[WordIsBond]

It’s an interesting thought.

I have a contract till Dec, 1 month contractor absence, so that’s an extra 2 months work till End of Feb.

My concern is that come Feb, a contract market that is already saturated will get even worse.

Hoping if I am available immediately I can secure something else. Damn but there’s a lot of applicants out there

1. If you don't want the Dec contractor absence, and the work justifies it, you could make the pitch, "Sorry, this new training contract shouldn't be on a contractor absence, we only have until Feb to get these people trained. This contract should be different, you need to make an exception for it." Maybe they won't accept that but you can try (if you want).

2. If you are looking for outside work, yes, come Feb, the market will be even worse, but it's pretty bad right now, too, isn't it?

3. If you are willing to accept brolly or perm roles, come Feb a bunch of clients like Barclays, etc, are going to be frantically trying to replace a bunch of people who just walked. There's going to be a lot of upheaval but there will certainly be roles available.

4. My guess is by the summer there are going to be outside roles starting to pop up again because clients will need people. Feb takes you a couple months closer to that. How's your warchest?

Just a few more things to consider. Ultimately none of us know what will happen so you are just going to have to weigh up probabilities and the impact of each possibility on you personally, and make your decision accordingly.

[BABABlackSheep]

1. If you don't want the Dec contractor absence, and the work justifies it, you could make the pitch, "Sorry, this new training contract shouldn't be on a contractor absence, we only have until Feb to get these people trained. This contract should be different, you need to make an exception for it." Maybe they won't accept that but you can try (if you want).

2. If you are looking for outside work, yes, come Feb, the market will be even worse, but it's pretty bad right now, too, isn't it?

3. If you are willing to accept brolly or perm roles, come Feb a bunch of clients like Barclays, etc, are going to be frantically trying to replace a bunch of people who just walked. There's going to be a lot of upheaval but there will certainly be roles available.

4. My guess is by the summer there are going to be outside roles starting to pop up again because clients will need people. Feb takes you a couple months closer to that. How's your warchest?

Just a few more things to consider. Ultimately none of us know what will happen so you are just going to have to weigh up probabilities and the impact of each possibility on you personally, and make your decision accordingly.

It’s good advice. I agree with everything you say. I’m happy to take Brolly for now, just not at a client I’ve worked for a while at.

My warchest is about a year’s worth. Not going to take any pension this year if brolly/MVL option is in play.

[Amanensia]

I’m happy to take Brolly for now, just not at a client I’ve worked for a while at.

Speaking as a fellow current LBG contractor, this is also my approach. They've asked if I'll stay on current terms until end Feb, but I'm going to bail at end Dec. I feel pretty bad for the project team I'm working with, as they are up against big regulatory deadlines, but at the end of the day it's the bank that's put them in this situation, not me.

I did think quite hard about accepting an umbrella role for a while - apart from anything else it's an interesting project and excellent from a CV point of view - but decided it's just a bit of an unnecessary risk. I'd rather be out the door well in advance of the changes. This is probably over-cautious of me, but if I have to go umbrella for a while, it'll be elsewhere, and by leaving in Dec I'm available to jump into the shoes of people who bail elsewhere in Q1.

[ProjectPimp]

Speaking as a fellow current LBG contractor, this is also my approach. They've asked if I'll stay on current terms until end Feb, but I'm going to bail at end Dec. I feel pretty bad for the project team I'm working with, as they are up against big regulatory deadlines, but at the end of the day it's the bank that's put them in this situation, not me.

I am taking exactly this approach. I've been offered an extension until 31st March, which I have declined as I think this screams "she's inside so she has to go!". I will bail in December and hope I find something else, either permie or brolly, next year.

It's scary how little LBG understand about the situation. The manager who gave me The Chat was asking me what the new legislation is...