A Sad “IR35” Day

[LondonPM1]

As a CIO, For the avoidance of any doubt; this is how it will play our for stubborn contractors.

Contractor : I have special skills and knowledge that nobody else has. No permie can ever do my job and I won't show anyone how to do it.

CIO : IBM / Cognizant / Accenture etc... can you do this job please?

Service Providers : Yes we can, and we can do it offshore for half the price if you like.

End.

Gone are the days where we pay 1500 a day for consultants from service providers. And don't give me that racist cr@p that Indians are rubbish. The most skilled, innovative, progressive and hard working people I have worked with over the last 10 years have all come from India.

Why did you not get these people in at the start in that case?

[CFC]

Why did you not get these people in at the start in that case?

Thinking of only using SI's as contractors will always backfire. On any project implemented by an SI, especially if its a big transformation project, you need a client team and the SI team. The client team is usually formed out of contractors, if the market is niche such as HR transformations. This is to have expertise on both sides, as an SI would always be looking to increase their revenue with different change requests.

Plus, big companies, would not give you 1 person if that's all you need. These contracts would usually come with a limit, such as a minimum of 3 consultants for example, which in the long run may not be as profitable as originally thought.

[vwdan]

As a CIO, For the avoidance of any doubt; this is how it will play our for stubborn contractors.

Contractor : I have special skills and knowledge that nobody else has. No permie can ever do my job and I won't show anyone how to do it.

CIO : IBM / Cognizant / Accenture etc... can you do this job please?

Service Providers : Yes we can, and we can do it offshore for half the price if you like.

End.

Gone are the days where we pay 1500 a day for consultants from service providers. And don't give me that racist cr@p that Indians are rubbish. The most skilled, innovative, progressive and hard working people I have worked with over the last 10 years have all come from India.

Absolutely expected and understandable. And y'know what, I'll even take your call in 6 months time when they've fluffed it right up.

The most skilled, innovative, progressive and hard working people I have worked with over the last 10 years have all come from India

I've met some great ones too, the problem is those people aren't working for cheap outsourcers

[dx4100]

I've met some great ones too, the problem is those people aren't working for cheap outsourcers

True story

[AndrewK]

As a CIO, For the avoidance of any doubt; this is how it will play our for stubborn contractors.

Contractor : I have special skills and knowledge that nobody else has. No permie can ever do my job and I won't show anyone how to do it.

CIO : IBM / Cognizant / Accenture etc... can you do this job please?

Service Providers : Yes we can, and we can do it offshore for half the price if you like.

End.

Gone are the days where we pay 1500 a day for consultants from service providers. And don't give me that racist cr@p that Indians are rubbish. The most skilled, innovative, progressive and hard working people I have worked with over the last 10 years have all come from India.

"IBM / Cognizant / Accenture ... most skilled, progressive and hard working." Wow. Statement of the year.
Either your standards are very low or you never met skilled person.

[BABABlackSheep]

Wow this thread grew legs quickly

As someone who has previously worked for a consultancy(was IBM) for a long time, and have indeed been charged out to clients at stupid prices whilst there, and very familiar with WiPro and TSC as I work with them right now I can give my honest opinion.

Back in the day, the offshore model was absolutely terrible, and the standard of work was poor. However, lately, with my onshore colleagues, for especially development and testing, I've seen them do some fantastic work.

Personally, I'm a BA(clue in the name). One of the reasons I moved from more a technical infrastructure to Business Analysis career, is I saw the writing on the wall with the consultancies business model, but I didn't see that moving into the softer more business focused roles, mainly because of cultural differences. In other words, their BA's and PM's to a large extend I've not seen many of, and the the one's I have, I've not been that impressed. Solution Architects, I'm on the fence with. Some good, some not so good.

[BABABlackSheep]

Meanwhile, given the nature of my opening post. I'll ask my "new" friends on here

What would you do, if you worked for one of the major banks who have just told everyone to go permie or go home, if you had another contract offer, but they wanted you to start in less than 2 weeks' whilst you are on a 4 week contract termination?

[Snooky]

Meanwhile, given the nature of my opening post. I'll ask my "new" friends on here

What would you do, if you worked for one of the major banks who have just told everyone to go permie or go home, if you had another contract offer, but they wanted you to start in less than 2 weeks' whilst you are on a 4 week contract termination?

If they were going to throw me under the bus IR35 wise or had been generally not a great client, the stress of it all would probably make me so ill I'd have to call in sick for those last few weeks...

[Paralytic]

Meanwhile, given the nature of my opening post. I'll ask my "new" friends on here

What would you do, if you worked for one of the major banks who have just told everyone to go permie or go home, if you had another contract offer, but they wanted you to start in less than 2 weeks' whilst you are on a 4 week contract termination?

Is the contract also with LBG or with a new client?

It would depend on their documented approach to IR35 and length of contract.

[cojak]

Meanwhile, given the nature of my opening post. I'll ask my "new" friends on here

What would you do, if you worked for one of the major banks who have just told everyone to go permie or go home, if you had another contract offer, but they wanted you to start in less than 2 weeks' whilst you are on a 4 week contract termination?

Take it.

I've been in places where the contractor bunked off the last four weeks through 'illness'.

BITD I would have been more professional - but it's a dog eat dog world out there and if the clients are doing this I would cut my losses on not getting my last invoice paid and leave.