*rant* Umbrellas - FCSA members illustrations / calcs - 52 working weeks FFS

[GhostofTarbera]

My initial enquiries with the big umbrellas has not gone too well.

Some haven't responded at all, others say the costs vary depending on who my agency is (confused), and others insist I must have a 15min sales call.

Must be a busy time for them, but it doesn't fill one with huge confidence when all you asked for is the calculation that Clarity give you on their website as standard

Unfortunately I will likely have to use one if I take a role I am eyeing up due to the PSL.

Not sure why your not getting the fact that at the end of the day the only difference in any umbrella will be their margin and that will be peanuts

One can’t magically pay you more than the others


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[eek]

Not sure why your not getting the fact that at the end of the day the only difference in any umbrella will be their margin and that will be peanuts

One can’t magically pay you more than the others


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

+1 The only difference between umbrella really are:-

1) Speed of payment relative to receipt (must be same day process and same day or BACs payment)
2) Responsiveness of staff (phone / email)
3) Salary Sacrifice into pension (how, where to and how much extra)
4) Perkbox / Staff Treats
5) Other Salary Sacrifice options (health care / car / cycle to work)....

Given that the rates are almost fixed (£90 a month say) and everything else is equal these really are the only things that matter.

[youngguy]

Not sure why your not getting the fact that at the end of the day the only difference in any umbrella will be their margin and that will be peanuts

One can’t magically pay you more than the others


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

I'm aware of that and I appreciate it isn't a lot of money, but I do take the view if the initial response is quite slow,unclear and a company doesn't seem overly keen to answer Qs etc....it might be a sign of poor service to come.

That is a bit of a generalisation of course, but it tends to be how I try and choose any supplier I use....first impressions and all that!

[youngguy]

+1 The only difference between umbrella really are:-

1) Speed of payment relative to receipt (must be same day process and same day or BACs payment)
2) Responsiveness of staff (phone / email)
3) Salary Sacrifice into pension (how, where to and how much extra)
4) Perkbox / Staff Treats
5) Other Salary Sacrifice options (health care / car / cycle to work)....

Given that the rates are almost fixed (£90 a month say) and everything else is equal these really are the only things that matter.

Agree, and my enquires so far have indicated 1 and 2 are lacking. 3 & 4 were in my questions but of course no one has responded yet.

I guess that's the advantage of paying to be on a PSL - less need to stand out in terms of good service.

[youngguy]

Some umbrella companies have reduced margins for some agencies, depending on what others on the PSL are offering.

If your margin is £95 per month, and others are offering £85 per month, you will be quick to reduce it too.


Kind regards

Zeeshan

Am I being a thickie? Just wondering how a reduction benefits the agency?

Obviously if the umbrella is paying the agency to be on the PSL that's different, but what benefit is there for an agency if the umbrella charges the contractor £85 instead of £95?

[GhostofTarbera]

I'm aware of that and I appreciate it isn't a lot of money, but I do take the view if the initial response is quite slow,unclear and a company doesn't seem overly keen to answer Qs etc....it might be a sign of poor service to come.

That is a bit of a generalisation of course, but it tends to be how I try and choose any supplier I use....first impressions and all that!

What do you expect for £10 profit per month to umbrella comps? That’s 3 cups of coffee


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

[eek]

Am I being a thickie? Just wondering how a reduction benefits the agency?

Obviously if the umbrella is paying the agency to be on the PSL that's different, but what benefit is there for an agency if the umbrella charges the contractor £85 instead of £95?

You are missing the point.

4 umbrellas on a PSL - if 2 charge £85 and 2 charge £95 few people are going to use ones changing £95 so to get some of the business from the agency all the umbrellas will discount their monthly fee to £85.

Umbrellas are a volume game which means its profitable to accept a lower profit margin on workers using some agencies to get the volume up.

[youngguy]

You are missing the point.

4 umbrellas on a PSL - if 2 charge £85 and 2 charge £95 few people are going to use ones changing £95 so to get some of the business from the agency all the umbrellas will discount their monthly fee to £85.

Umbrellas are a volume game which means its profitable to accept a lower profit margin on workers using some agencies to get the volume up.

Ah Gotcha! I was being a thickie

[youngguy]

What do you expect for £10 profit per month to umbrella comps? That’s 3 cups of coffee


Sent from my iPhone using Contractor UK Forum

For me, a service is getting what was promised for the price that the company set out.

I know you think the price is so low we should expect almost nothing, but that's not what these companies promise. Many go to great lengths to explain how well looked after we will be as their employees! (Side point, surely umbrellas are 'disguised employers'?!).

As I've said to a certain other grumpy chap here, opinions differ and I understand where you coming from, I just see things differently.

Of course part of this is likely my reluctance to have to use an umbrella at all. C'est la vie!

[lucyclarityumbrella]

Umbrella is an expensive, numbers game - in order to be compliant it costs, that's just fact!

Those charging minimal figures either have thousands of contractors on their books, or it is smaller company who cannot feasible survive long term at such low margins remaining compliant.