Reply to: No whites!

[SueEllen]

not in the US where this sort of tulip comes from

It's been pointed out in this thread that other events in the UK e.g. museum nights, are already specifically aimed at particular self-identifying groups in the UK population. This has been going on for a good few years.

I think the issue with this playwright is that he's up his own behind as other event organisers manage to do these things without winding up other segments of the population.

Anyway as I said if you really want to see his play on one of those nights, there is nothing stopping you identifying as black. Just have a story prepared of why you are and don't make yourself look like Rachel Dolezal...

[vetran]

not in the US where this sort of tulip comes from

[hobnob]

I was not using Londonistan in an Islamaphobic way.

a) I don't believe you.
b) "-stan" is normally used for the name of a country (e.g. Afghanistan). "-abad" is normally used for the name of a city (e.g. Hyderabad).

Coming back on topic, it's not as if white people are banned from ever seeing this play. It's just that some performances are only for a certain group. In a similar way, I've been to the cinema when they have "over 18s" screenings, which are independent of the film's certification (e.g. they include "U" certificate films); the cinema isn't saying that kids/teenagers aren't welcome, just that there's an opportunity for adults to watch a film without them being around. Another example might be gyms that have women only sessions.

[NotAllThere]

I was not using Londonistan in an Islamaphobic way. Hindus and Sikhs, of which i am one, also use 'Stan' as a suffix as well, eg Hindustan and Khalistan.

Sure you weren't. And when people yell "jihad" at pro-Palestinian marches, they just means personal struggle, not armed conflict and killing all the Jews.

[NotAllThere]

maths

[Fraidycat]

Hence you are an Islamophobe and I claim my 5 sheckels. But we knew that already.

I was not using Londonistan in an Islamaphobic way. Hindus and Sikhs, of which i am one, also use 'Stan' as a suffix as well, eg Hindustan and Khalistan.

[vetran]

Not just that, but also used their naval power to disrupt the trade. It cost Britain a huge amount to abolish slavery and to do that. With no real goal than to do the right thing. I'm fairly sure that should cover any reparations due.

I'm interested to see how they deal with the fact ~90% were purchased from their fellow Africans. Their only real alternative was to be sold to the Arabs where they had about 20% chance of surviving the trip as against >80% survival with the Brits.

Should make the math challenging.

As you say The Brits stopped slavery at significant cost in lives & money. This obsession with misrepresenting the facts to obtain advantage would be considered fraudulent in other situations.

[vetran]

Or the fact that in the United States there were at least 3700 black slave owners who owned ~13000 slaves between them. Shines a whole new light on the expression "Yo, my N****r!", doesn't it?

I hadn't realised there were that many! Interesting thanks.

[NotAllThere]

The British after 200 years realised that slavery was wrong and an affront to their God

Not just that, but also used their naval power to disrupt the trade. It cost Britain a huge amount to abolish slavery and to do that. With no real goal than to do the right thing. I'm fairly sure that should cover any reparations due.

[Zigenare]

They know exactly what they are doing, it creates publicity. They know it is inherently racist. They don't care because it sells tickets to what sounds like a crappy play describing being racist about mixed marriages.

This constant whining about Black man's "oppression" by the whites because of slavery is sad.

I am waiting for some historian to point out how in 4,500 years of recorded slavery in Africa (there are documents showing they voluntarily sold their brothers to the Arabs as slaves in 2500 BCE probably much earlier). The white man was only there for 2-300 years and the Europeans and British bought millions of slaves off the local chiefs & kings which the Africans kings liked because it drove the price up because the Arabs kept on buying .

The Portuguese did have the Pope's blessing and written exclusivity to run African Slaves. We forget purchasing and owning slaves was completely legal internationally backed by society and the church. Oddly these never get mentioned. Same for the French , Germans who also were big in slave trading post the 1500s when the Europeans got there a mere 4 millennia after the first recorded African to Arab slave trading.

The British after 200 years realised that slavery was wrong and an affront to their God (odd as Africa embraced Jesus long before Europe). A cynic may suggest it seems like they are annoyed we ruined one of their key industries selling their people as slaves.

Or the fact that in the United States there were at least 3700 black slave owners who owned ~13000 slaves between them. Shines a whole new light on the expression "Yo, my N****r!", doesn't it?

[vetran]

When are you becoming a radio host?

Listening to a discussion about this now.

They know exactly what they are doing, it creates publicity. They know it is inherently racist. They don't care because it sells tickets to what sounds like a crappy play describing being racist about mixed marriages.

This constant whining about Black man's "oppression" by the whites because of slavery is sad.

I am waiting for some historian to point out how in 4,500 years of recorded slavery in Africa (there are documents showing they voluntarily sold their brothers to the Arabs as slaves in 2500 BCE probably much earlier). The white man was only there for 2-300 years and the Europeans and British bought millions of slaves off the local chiefs & kings which the Africans kings liked because it drove the price up because the Arabs kept on buying .

The Portuguese did have the Pope's blessing and written exclusivity to run African Slaves. We forget purchasing and owning slaves was completely legal internationally backed by society and the church. Oddly these never get mentioned. Same for the French , Germans who also were big in slave trading post the 1500s when the Europeans got there a mere 4 millennia after the first recorded African to Arab slave trading.

The British after 200 years realised that slavery was wrong and an affront to their God (odd as Africa embraced Jesus long before Europe). A cynic may suggest it seems like they are annoyed we ruined one of their key industries selling their people as slaves.

[vetran]

I saw Status Quo twice in the 80s, both times I'm sure I was the only Asian there but it was fine

The only time I encountered any Hells Angels at a gig was prog rockers Marillion of all people, headlining at Milton Keynes Bowl. I was still at school and TBH it was a bit frightening getting caught in the middle of a fracas between a bunch of them and another group.

We had Chas & Dave supporting it was awesome!

Bit of exaggeration while there were a few Hells Angels but there were also grannies in the bleachers.

Have bumped into a few in various pubs.

[SueEllen]

You are giving them more credit that most people then. I don't think they've been misguided, I'd say they know very well what they are doing. They'll tell the press some fluff to try justify it but I don't think it's got anything to do with safe spaces or making the world better. It looks more like an activist mentality and they are out to shock and make a statement.

That said though, if I'm wrong and it does genuinely bring the theater to those that haven't wanted to go before and they start attending more shows that aren't divided then fair play to him.. but I just don't think that's how this is gonna pan out.

EDIT : Actually all that said, just had a read around and there are number of 'Black Out' events been held over the years recenty, they come and they go, appear to be pretty successful and no harm appears to have been done. There was one in 2022 in London and there are a couple of articles discussing it but nothing like the outrage that appears to be going on with this one.

So i've change my mind somewhat. I think the problem is the media coverage that's whipping the storm, not the actual event. It will run, people will enjoy it and it will go away until another isolated one further down the line. Doesn't appear to be the start of segragation and it doesn't look like it's anywhere near becoming a norm. Possibly a discussion to be had about terms like no whites, white gaze and white theater goes being 'unwelcome'. They could have stepped too far over the line or it's the press that's blown it out of proportion. If it's the former then a bit of re-think wouldn't go amiss.

When are you becoming a radio host?

Listening to a discussion about this now.

[edison]

Hey I went to see Status Quo in the 80s, we were the only non Hells Angels! Definitely felt unsafe.

Friend of mine (horribly white lineage probably goes back before 1066) married an African Lady and their children are mixed race, for her birthday party they used to live in a tiny flat so they booked a night club in Croydon. His Parents, my wife & I plus my mate were the only whites, many of those in the club were quite unfriendly I can see how that might feel like oppression.

I saw Status Quo twice in the 80s, both times I'm sure I was the only Asian there but it was fine

The only time I encountered any Hells Angels at a gig was prog rockers Marillion of all people, headlining at Milton Keynes Bowl. I was still at school and TBH it was a bit frightening getting caught in the middle of a fracas between a bunch of them and another group.

[edison]

You are giving them more credit that most people then. I don't think they've been misguided, I'd say they know very well what they are doing. They'll tell the press some fluff to try justify it but I don't think it's got anything to do with safe spaces or making the world better. It looks more like an activist mentality and they are out to shock and make a statement.

That said though, if I'm wrong and it does genuinely bring the theater to those that haven't wanted to go before and they start attending more shows that aren't divided then fair play to him.. but I just don't think that's how this is gonna pan out.

EDIT : Actually all that said, just had a read around and there are number of 'Black Out' events been held over the years recenty, they come and they go, appear to be pretty successful and no harm appears to have been done. There was one in 2022 in London and there are a couple of articles discussing it but nothing like the outrage that appears to be going on with this one.

So i've change my mind somewhat. I think the problem is the media coverage that's whipping the storm, not the actual event. It will run, people will enjoy it and it will go away until another isolated one further down the line. Doesn't appear to be the start of segragation and it doesn't look like it's anywhere near becoming a norm. Possibly a discussion to be had about terms like no whites, white gaze and white theater goes being 'unwelcome'. They could have stepped too far over the line or it's the press that's blown it out of proportion. If it's the former then a bit of re-think wouldn't go amiss.

Yes, these 'blackout' events have been going on for a few years. I recall an event organised to encourage Asian women to attend one of the big London museums or galleries. Encouraging more ethnic minorities to attend cultural events is a laudable aim but as you say, terms like white gaze and safe spaces annoys/offends a significant number of people and doesn't help.