Monday Links from the Gap Between Teams Meetings vol. DCCVIII

[northernladuk]

Anyone else noticed the mistake on Big Ben's clock face?

Oh yeah. Not hard to spot when you are actually looking for something wrong. Kudos for that spot.

[mudskipper]

Anyone else noticed the mistake on Big Ben's clock face?

[vetran]

Germany owned up and fully repented (arguably too much). They have done everything possible to show that is not who they are.

Japan never did and still frankly in denial.

Ignoring Nazis being more personal to us, its easier to talk about (or attack) something that isn't going to sour international relations.

Germany is peachy ! No chance of them voting in another right wing extremist again

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...erman-politics

The far-right Alternative für Deutschland has won a district council election in Germany for the first time, in what is being referred to as a watershed moment in the country’s politics.

The eastern town of Sonneberg, in the state of Thuringia, elected Robert Sesselmann to the post of district administrator, the equivalent of a mayor, with 52.8% of the vote, ousting the Christian Democrats’ (CDU) Jurgen Köpper on 47.2%.

The Thuringia branch of the anti-immigrant party has been classed as rightwing extremist by intelligence services. It is led by Björn Höcke, who is considered to be part of the AfD’s far right or völkisch wing, which was officially disbanded but is still widely believed to exist.

Totally agree the Japanese have not atoned in any significant way.

[JustKeepSwimming]

For the Japanese from what I understand "The Bridge on the River Kwai" sugar coated it. Strange we have spent years attacking the Germans for the Holocaust and haven't attacked the Japanese for their many and horrendous war crimes. Not minimalizing either they were both inhuman monsters.

Germany owned up and fully repented (arguably too much). They have done everything possible to show that is not who they are.

Japan never did and still frankly in denial.

Ignoring Nazis being more personal to us, its easier to talk about (or attack) something that isn't going to sour international relations.

[vetran]

^^^This.

It took the Russians until 1949.

The Germans didn't get a reactor going much less an isotope separation plant.

There's two ways: plutonium & U235.

Unless of course one believes in Die Glocke, Red Mercury, Ancient Aliens, or Magick Nazi Pixie Dust etc.

And where did I say that nuking the Japanese was a bad idea?

Considering the losses during the Okinawa invasion, the nukes were a godsend.

And it took the Japanese High Command a whole fortnight to realise what would happen otherwise.

I find it quite impressive that so many Septic nukes can be bashed, dropped, burned and otherwise abused without going off.

I worked with a chap who'd been a POW at a place outside, er, Nagasaki.

When the factory had Japanese visitors they had to hide him away because he hated them so much.

In his considered opinion, dropping another dozen or so bombs would have been ok.

I have to admire the positive sentiment but in retrospect. I did say they weren't far behind.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Lets go to a decent source.

https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhatt...945/rivals.htm

For most of the Second World War, scientists and administrators of the Manhattan Project firmly believed that they were in a race with Germany to develop the atomic bomb. As it turns out, the German atomic program did not come close to developing a useable weapon. Allied planners were only able to confirm this, however, through the ALSOS intelligence mission to Europe toward the end of the war. Atomic research was also conducted in Japan, but as was suspected by the Allies, it did not get very far.

They had jet fighters, cruise missiles, uranium, a head start (1939 not 42) and some of the world's best scientists (Einstein, Bohr & Werner [Von Braun & Heisenberg] - name a Manhattan project scientist without looking it up), pretty sure the experts on the Manhattan project would thank God every day after their test run!

For the Japanese from what I understand "The Bridge on the River Kwai" sugar coated it. Strange we have spent years attacking the Germans for the Holocaust and haven't attacked the Japanese for their many and horrendous war crimes. Not minimalizing either they were both inhuman monsters.

[DoctorStrangelove]

Germany and Russia were nowhere near producing a nuclear weapon during WW2 both were lacking in money, research personnel and will.

^^^This.

It took the Russians until 1949.

The Germans didn't get a reactor going much less an isotope separation plant.

There's two ways: plutonium & U235.

Unless of course one believes in Die Glocke, Red Mercury, Ancient Aliens, or Magick Nazi Pixie Dust etc.

And where did I say that nuking the Japanese was a bad idea?

Considering the losses during the Okinawa invasion, the nukes were a godsend.

And it took the Japanese High Command a whole fortnight to realise what would happen otherwise.

I find it quite impressive that so many Septic nukes can be bashed, dropped, burned and otherwise abused without going off.

I worked with a chap who'd been a POW at a place outside, er, Nagasaki.

When the factory had Japanese visitors they had to hide him away because he hated them so much.

In his considered opinion, dropping another dozen or so bombs would have been ok.

[northernladuk]

• Is the Army’s New Tactical Bra Ready for Deployment? - All you need to know about the Army Tactical Brassiere: ”It’s fire-resistant but not bulletproof, and was developed with help from eighteen thousand female soldiers.”

Just to save most posters the time.. No pics.

[vetran]

On that mechanical windmill thing, it's true that it may be much easier/cheaper to focus on direct heat generation. In the summer I have cold showers and the water is not unpleasantly cold because the pipes come through the hot attic. Next door neighbours had a water heating system installed, water goes through a black grid on the roof, on a sunny day it's quite effective even in winter.

Its all over Europe you see roof mounted water heat collectors and 'camp showers' are very common, it strikes me as a cheap ECO option putting a radiator on the roof to pre-heat water/air.

[vetran]

Germany and Russia were nowhere near producing a nuclear weapon during WW2 both were lacking in money, research personnel and will.

I and a few experts have to disagree with you there. The Germans were well on their way. The Russians spies on Manhattan were well imbedded.


We wasted air miles going to Norway on a whim.

https://www.royalmarineshistory.com/...es-of-telemark
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/hydro/water.html

On the eve of World War II, scientists both in Germany and Great Britain realized that heavy water could be used in this way to make nuclear weapons. And because this potential still exists today, the International Atomic Energy Agency and various national governments monitor the production and distribution of heavy water.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/hydro/close.html

During the last months of the war, a small group of scientists working in secret under Diebner and with the strong support of the physicist Walther Gerlach, who was by that time head of the uranium project, built and tested a nuclear device.

At best this would have been far less destructive than the atomic bombs dropped on Japan. Rather it is an example of scientists trying to make any sort of weapon they could in order to help stave off defeat. No one knows the exact form of the device tested. But apparently the German scientists had designed it to use chemical high explosives configured in a hollow shell in order to provoke both nuclear fission and nuclear fusion reactions. It is not clear whether this test generated nuclear reactions, but it does appear as if this is what the scientists had intended to occur.

and

https://www.sciencealert.com/startli...uclear-program

"If the Germans had pooled their resources, rather than keeping them divided among separate, rival experiments, they may have been able to build a working nuclear reactor," says Hiebert.

"This highlights perhaps the biggest difference between the German and American nuclear research programs. The German program was divided and competitive; whereas, under the leadership of General Leslie Groves, the American Manhattan Project was centralised and collaborative."

Remember NASA were quite keen on getting German rocket scientists as well as Einstein.

Admittedly the Soviets were busy fighting back Hitler's suicidal attack on Russia but Stalin pursued it after the US success. So if the USA had been bogged down with the Japanese then the stolen plans would have certainly resulted in a Soviet copy as they did in 1949.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet...c_bomb_project

[Zigenare]

We definitely wouldn't have been where we are if the atomic bomb had not been invented and used remember the Germans & Russians weren't far behind.

Germany and Russia were nowhere near producing a nuclear weapon during WW2 both were lacking in money, research personnel and will.

[xoggoth]

On that mechanical windmill thing, it's true that it may be much easier/cheaper to focus on direct heat generation. In the summer I have cold showers and the water is not unpleasantly cold because the pipes come through the hot attic. Next door neighbours had a water heating system installed, water goes through a black grid on the roof, on a sunny day it's quite effective even in winter.

[vetran]

Further to the Oppie thing, this is really encouraging:

https://thebulletin.org/wp-content/u...-pages_DoD.pdf

It's a fecking miracle we're still here.

From:

https://thebulletin.org/premium/2023.../#post-heading

We definitely wouldn't have been where we are if the atomic bomb had not been invented and used remember the Germans & Russians weren't far behind. Japan would have fought to the last and the Russians would probably have sat back and watched until either the Japanese or ideally for them the USA had been flattened and the Russians would have cleaned up with Nukes or conventional forces. The Cold war demonstrated that plenty was still going on. Oppenheimer & Truman saved millions.


https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...n-used/376238/

EXPLOREIf the Atomic Bomb Had Not Been Used


Was Japan already beaten before the August 1945 bombings?
By Karl T. ComptonThe atomic bombing of Hiroshima on August 6, 1945 (Library of Congress)
DECEMBER 1946 ISSUE
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About a week after V-J Day, I was one of a small group of scientists and engineers interrogating an intelligent, well-informed Japanese Army officer in Yokohama. We asked him what, in his opinion, would have been the next major move if the war had continued. He replied: "You would probably have tried to invade our homeland with a landing operation on Kyushu about November 1. I think the attack would have been made on such and such beaches."

"Could you have repelled this landing?" we asked, and he answered: "It would have been a very desperate fight, but I do not think we could have stopped you."

"What would have happened then?" we asked.

He replied: "We would have kept on fighting until all Japanese were killed, but we would not have been defeated," by which he meant that they would not have been disgraced by surrender.

It is easy now, after the event, to look back and say that Japan was already a beaten nation, and to ask what therefore was the justification for the use of the atomic bomb to kill so many thousands of helpless Japanese in this inhuman way; furthermore, should we not better have kept it to ourselves as a secret weapon for future use, if necessary? This argument has been advanced often, but it seems to me utterly fallacious.

I had, perhaps, an unusual opportunity to know the pertinent facts from several angles, yet I was without responsibility for any of the decisions. I can therefore speak without doing so defensively. While my role in the atomic bomb development was a very minor one, I was a member of the group called together by Secretary of War Stimson to assist him in plans for its test, use, and subsequent handling. Then, shortly before Hiroshima, I became attached to General MacArthur in Manila, and lived for two months with his staff. In this way I learned something of the invasion plans and of the sincere conviction of these best-informed officers that a desperate and costly struggle was still ahead. Finally, I spent the first month after V-J Day in Japan, where I could ascertain at first hand both the physical and the psychological state of that country. Some of the Japanese whom I consulted were my scientific and personal friends of long standing.

From this background I believe, with complete conviction, that the use of the atomic bomb saved hundreds of thousands—perhaps several millions—of lives, both American and Japanese; that without its use the war would have continued for many months; that no one of good conscience knowing, as Secretary Stimson and the Chiefs of Staff did, what was probably ahead and what the atomic bomb might accomplish could have made any different decision. Let some of the facts speak for themselves.

Was the use of the atomic bomb inhuman? All war is inhuman. Here are some comparisons of the atomic bombing with conventional bombing. At Hiroshima the atomic bomb killed about 80,000 people, pulverized about five square miles, and wrecked an additional ten square miles of the city, with decreasing damage out to seven or eight miles from the center. At Nagasaki the fatal casualties were 45,000 and the area wrecked was considerably smaller than at Hiroshima because of the configuration of the city.

Compare this with the results of two B-29 incendiary raids over Tokyo. One of these raids killed about 125,000 people, the other nearly 100,000.

Of the 210 square miles of greater Tokyo, 85 square miles of the densest part was destroyed as completely, for all practical purposes, as were the centers of Hiroshima and Nagasaki; about half the buildings were destroyed in the remaining 125 square miles; the number of people driven homeless out of Tokyo was considerably larger than the population of greater Chicago. These figures are based on information given us in Tokyo and on a detailed study of the air reconnaissance maps. They may be somewhat in error but are certainly of the right order of magnitude.

Was Japan already beaten before the atomic bomb? The answer is certainly "yes" in the sense that the fortunes of war had turned against her. The answer is "no" in the sense that she was still fighting desperately and there was every reason to believe that she would continue to do so; and this is the only answer that has any practical significance.

General MacArthur's staff anticipated about 50,000 American casualties and several times that number of Japanese casualties in the November 1 operation to establish the initial beachheads on Kyushu. After that they expected a far more costly struggle before the Japanese homeland was subdued. There was every reason to think that the Japanese would defend their homeland with even greater fanaticism than when they fought to the death on Iwo Jima and Okinawa. No American soldier who survived the bloody struggles on these islands has much sympathy with the view that battle with the Japanese was over as soon as it was clear that their ultimate situation was hopeless. No, there was every reason to expect a terrible struggle long after the point at which some people can now look back and say, "Japan was already beaten."

A month after our occupation I heard General MacArthur say that even then, if the Japanese government lost control over its people and the millions of former Japanese soldiers took to guerrilla warfare in the mountains, it could take a million American troops ten years to master the situation.

oh look a prequel to Korea & Vietnam.

[DoctorStrangelove]

Further to the Oppie thing, this is really encouraging:

https://thebulletin.org/wp-content/u...-pages_DoD.pdf

It's a fecking miracle we're still here.

From:

https://thebulletin.org/premium/2023.../#post-heading

[NickFitz]

I've double-checked after last week's paywall irritation and, at the time of posting, you should be able to get to the end of all of these

• The Battle of Fishkill - ”Domenic Broccoli, the IHOP kingpin of the Bronx, lives a good life… He owns a four-bedroom home in Pelham Manor, a house upstate, and IHOPs throughout the borough where he grew up, each of which runs smoothly enough to give Broccoli the time and resources to devote himself, at the age of 66, to the animating force in his life: destroying his enemies.” High drama in the world of pancakes
• How Quantum Physicists Explained Earth’s Oscillating Weather Patterns - Finally, a use for this quantum stuff: ”By treating Earth as a topological insulator — a state of quantum matter — physicists found a powerful explanation for the movements of the planet’s air and seas.”
• Oppenheimer: The man. The movie. The legacy. - A special issue of the Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists: ”[This] magazine itself was founded in 1945 by a group of atomic scientists and engineers, with J. Robert Oppenheimer—the director of the Los Alamos laboratory that built the first atomic bomb—serving as founding chair… About the only thing pundits seem to agree on is that Oppenheimer—hailed as the father of the atomic bomb before being vilified during the red scare of the 1950s for opposing the subsequent arms race—was brilliant.” Features include an interview with Christopher Nolan, director of the eponymous film.
• Create your own teletext service - ”Feeling retro? In the latest issue of The MagPi magazine, PJ Evans shows you how to turn any Raspberry Pi into a teletext broadcast service, make your own pages, and even generate content from the web.” HT to DoctorStrangelove for this blast from the past
• Big Ben - ”A unique puzzle for each second of the day, with a satisfying BONNGGG sound that shakes the game when you find a long word.” A new, extremely addictive word game
• A lone figure skis across a frozen sea, pursued by Russians shooting guns - ”How my grandfather left Finland and came to America.” John Sundman on his grandfather's hair-raising escape to the West.
• Heat your House with a Mechanical Windmill - ”Given the right conditions, a mechanical windmill with an oversized brake system is a cheap, effective, and sustainable heating system.” HT to vetran for this simple and convenient solution to fuel bill worries
• Is the Army’s New Tactical Bra Ready for Deployment? - All you need to know about the Army Tactical Brassiere: ”It’s fire-resistant but not bulletproof, and was developed with help from eighteen thousand female soldiers.”
• Taking the First Steps Into a Newly Formed Volcanic Underworld - ”More than a year after a devastating eruption in the Canary Islands, a team is exploring a braided network of still-hot lava tubes.” Some like it hot
• The 2023 Audubon Photography Awards: Winners and Honorable Mentions - ”We pored through thousands of entries for this year’s contest. The best images show birds going about their business in the most glorious ways.” These fine rock pigeons were photographed in British Columbia by Liron Gertsman.
  
  

Happy invoicing!