Originally posted by WTFH
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Reply to: Recycling Plastics Doesn't Work
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Previously on "Recycling Plastics Doesn't Work"
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Originally posted by ladymuck View Post
That's pretty much what I said in the first sentence of my second paragraph (re-read what you quoted). Thank you for mansplaining, I'm much clearer now about what I said.
Manufacturers and resellers will not change until people stop buying from them.
Actually manufacturers will change when people look like they will stop buying from them or there is a niche in the market.
You sentence suggested that people will have to stop buying from them for their attitude to change. As I have already pointed out many supermarkets are doing this as part of making their business more attractive to customers i.e. so people start buying or continue buying from them.
Companies I have worked with / for have actively looked for ways to cut waste and pollution as it has frequently saved costs, disposal is a cost for instance we reduced waste costs in the warehouse by £10s of thousands. Using less packing materials not only saved money (cheaper recycled materials were used e.g. cast cardboard (free to dispose of) rather than expanded foam business (cost to dispose) - it also saved the planet). As they redesigned with eco friendly packing they also sometimes found it to be lighter and smaller saving shipping costs.
It was also frequently required that we demonstrated such activities in tenders to large organisations.
Waitrose and Sainsburys haven't had a massive drop in sales because they wrap apples in plastic, they worked out its a marketing move and possibly cheaper.
Not buying is not the only lever as suggested above, soft power works as well.
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Originally posted by vetran View Post
Actually manufacturers will change when people look like they will stop buying from them or there is a niche in the market.
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Originally posted by ladymuck View PostBasically, it takes time, money and effort to eradicate plastic but it's cheap, easy and quick to stick with the status quo.
Manufacturers and resellers will not change until people stop buying from them. That won't happen because people are poor, lazy or simply don't know how to get the information they could use to make alternative choices. Biodegradable plastics - can't go in the recycling, has to be commercially composted, no collection system exists so what do you do with it? You can think you're buying wisely but it takes a lot of work to find out if you are or not.
We're all very privileged here, don't forget.
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Originally posted by TwoWolves View PostThe Oceans are in crisis but it's not US that are responsible for it and we need to have that conversation:
https://theoceancleanup.com/sources/
I was involved in conservation projects in the early 2000s in parts of Asia. The governments there really don't care and it's a very serious problem. Banning straws here is a drop in the ocean - literally.
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Basically, it takes time, money and effort to eradicate plastic but it's cheap, easy and quick to stick with the status quo.
Manufacturers and resellers will not change until people stop buying from them. That won't happen because people are poor, lazy or simply don't know how to get the information they could use to make alternative choices. Biodegradable plastics - can't go in the recycling, has to be commercially composted, no collection system exists so what do you do with it? You can think you're buying wisely but it takes a lot of work to find out if you are or not.
We're all very privileged here, don't forget.
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Originally posted by WTFH View Post
Not true.
Consumers can choose to buy products with less plastic on them. Individuals - including you - aren't forced to buy from a particular supplier, you could do research and buy off businesses that use less or no plastic.
But that requires effort and people taking responsibility for their actions, when it's always easier to blame someone else.
Not everyone can achieve your level of self-righteous smugness. Personally, I don't even aspire to it.
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The Oceans are in crisis but it's not US that are responsible for it and we need to have that conversation:
https://theoceancleanup.com/sources/
I was involved in conservation projects in the early 2000s in parts of Asia. The governments there really don't care and it's a very serious problem. Banning straws here is a drop in the ocean - literally.
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Originally posted by WTFH View PostSorry, I don't mean to be preachy, and I realise that not everyone can do it, but if each individual tries to do something, then it helps.
Sadly, it will be those at the poorer end of society who will struggle the most to make the changes needed.
If you can afford to spend a little more to reduce plastic then you really ought to. There is no justifiable reason why not.
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Originally posted by Paralytic View Post
Do you not think if that was really the case, then manufacturers etc would not already be doing this?
https://www.greenpeace.org.uk/news/s...able-rankings/
But if everyone switches costs go down.
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Originally posted by WTFH View Post
Not true.
Consumers can choose to buy products with less plastic on them. Individuals - including you - aren't forced to buy from a particular supplier, you could do research and buy off businesses that use less or no plastic.
But that requires effort and people taking responsibility for their actions, when it's always easier to blame someone else.
That requires the public to make it clear they want it.
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Originally posted by ladymuck View Post
I suspect it's also more expensive to buy those reduced plastic products and, especially for fresh produce, plastics are used to prolong shelf life which would require people to think about buying little and often which itself can be more expensive.
For other products - e.g. toilet roll - either choose one that comes in paper wrapping (e.g. Who Gives A Crap) or compostable wrapping.
Also you can buy cleaning products as concentrates that can be diluted down into reusable bottles, and beeswax paper that is a reusable alternate to clingfilm.
And if you have the opportunity, buy milk from a local farm vending machine - e.g. https://www.theudderstuff.co.uk
Sorry, I don't mean to be preachy, and I realise that not everyone can do it, but if each individual tries to do something, then it helps.
When it comes to food & drink, I'm trying to eat fresh, eat local, eat seasonal.
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