Reply to: Has any one refused Covid Vaccination?

[NotAllThere]

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1...415v1.full.pdf

What's not valid about it?

Have another look at that document. See that bit at the top? It reads: "...not certified by peer review..." Medrixiv.org is a pre-print server. That means not peer reviewed. It may have mistakes in process or analysis that invalidate it. It's promising, but not "the science" yet.
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[northernladuk]

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1...415v1.full.pdf

What's not valid about it?

There are plenty of countries that recognize natural immunity don't get me wrong. Lot's of countries that are following the science in their messaging. Just the US federal government is not one of them.

Lucky we aren't in the US then

[jayn200]

You know in this day and age you can go research beyond the messages you are being fed in the news and on TV don't you? I think you've either only been watching/reading the wrong stuff or not enough of it. Plenty PH and scientific messages out there.



Ah, definitely reading the wrong stuff then.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1...415v1.full.pdf

What's not valid about it?

There are plenty of countries that recognize natural immunity don't get me wrong. Lot's of countries that are following the science in their messaging. Just the US federal government is not one of them.

[d000hg]

Oh you'll know if you had a good dose of flu alright. If you think you've had it it was either extremly mild or it wasn't.

This chestnut is up there with "do or don't there is no try". I think being incapacitated for several days is likely an indication of flu, but it's not a guarantee.

The NHS say, and I see no reason to doubt them (especially as they are on a major Flu jab drive this winter)

The symptoms of flu are similar to a very bad cold. They include a high temperature, an aching body, tiredness and a headache.

People who say "you'd know if it was flu" probably had a particularly bad bout and don't realise it can vary from year to year and person to person. Or maybe they get some sort of odd superiority "you didn't have what I had", because people will find the strangest things to boast about.

[northernladuk]

It's challenging, a lot (almost all) of the messaging around Covid and Covid vaccine has been more akin to wartime propaganda than it has to any kind of public health messaging or scientific messaging. .

You know in this day and age you can go research beyond the messages you are being fed in the news and on TV don't you? I think you've either only been watching/reading the wrong stuff or not enough of it. Plenty PH and scientific messages out there.

We have good quality studies showing natural immunity is much much stronger and lasts longer than vaccine immunity yet many countries don't recognize it, general advice is to still get vaccinated regardless when the science really doesn't support it.

Ah, definitely reading the wrong stuff then.

[northernladuk]

Pretty sure I've had flu - bad enough to cancel Christmas and we didn't even care - but I don't rush for a flu jab and I don't think I'm immune. Probably take one this year since they're making a massive push and we have some pretty elderly types in our church I want to do my best to protect

Oh you'll know if you had a good dose of flu alright. If you think you've had it it was either extremly mild or it wasn't.

[jayn200]

I haven't got it yet, I'm on the fence. Probably will end up getting it this month as it's a requirement for something I want to do.

It's challenging, a lot (almost all) of the messaging around Covid and Covid vaccine has been more akin to wartime propaganda than it has to any kind of public health messaging or scientific messaging. We have good quality studies showing natural immunity is much much stronger and lasts longer than vaccine immunity yet many countries don't recognize it, general advice is to still get vaccinated regardless when the science really doesn't support it.

Then when talking about the USA you have to realise what's going on with their government. The current government right now is telling people continually on multiple issues to not believe what they see on multiple fronts. I won't get into it as I don't want to derail the thread too hard... but gaslighting has become this super popular word last couple years and that's exactly what the current USA government and most of the media have been doing... telling people not to believe what they see... some examples like "peaceful protests" while cities were burned to the ground... Doesn't help that the president just got a booster on a fake TV set in a simulated scene, while he likely did get a booster given his age and poor circulatory system health (multiple prior aneurysms) it doesn't really give confidence when the scene is faked.

So yeah its unfortunate lots of older adults and other high risk individuals have not got vaccinated, they definitely should. But I completely understand why they haven't. It's really the governments fault, especially in the USA where trust is really at an all time low (and rightfully so).

[Paralytic]

~35000 cases per day in the last 45 days (~50000 per day before) indicate otherwise.

If you are implying that those figures indicate that the vaccine does not reduce transmission, you truly are an idiot of the highest order.

[Whorty]

~35000 cases per day in the last 45 days (~50000 per day before) indicate otherwise.

We were in lockdown before ... and everything is open now?

[Eirikur]

~35000 cases per day in the last 45 days (~50000 per day before) indicate otherwise.

What the antivaxxers also ignore is the fact that last time we had 35k + cases per day we had 1000+ deaths per day now that has been significantly reduced to ~125 per day

[Eirikur]

Was double vaccinated in Spring, got covid a month ago and will have my booster in a few weeks time, should be super immune

[gisp]

vaccine is not just about reducing one's own risk, but about the risk of passing it on.

~35000 cases per day in the last 45 days (~50000 per day before) indicate otherwise.

[Paralytic]

They don't but many people get very ill from it and some die. I'd imagine most people that aren't having jabs haven't had flu yet. When you've had a good solid dose of it you'll be running for your jabs. I did.

I'm sure Covid will end up like that where people don't and will dodge a dose of covid for ever more and that's their choice but thinking they are immune because they've had it is completely wrong.

What many anti-vaxxers don't seem to get/ignore is the vaccine is not just about reducing one's own risk, but about the risk of passing it on. But, we have to accept that there will always be selfish people who only think about the impact to themselves.

[TwoWolves]

And? Although they don't know they think immunity can last up to 8 months. The first wave was much longer ago than that. Is it worth the gamble?

I'm a Contractor. I'm quite comfortable with risk.

[d000hg]

They don't but many people get very ill from it and some die. I'd imagine most people that aren't having jabs haven't had flu yet. When you've had a good solid dose of it you'll be running for your jabs. I did.

I'm sure Covid will end up like that where people don't and will dodge a dose of covid for ever more and that's their choice but thinking they are immune because they've had it is completely wrong.

Pretty sure I've had flu - bad enough to cancel Christmas and we didn't even care - but I don't rush for a flu jab and I don't think I'm immune. Probably take one this year since they're making a massive push and we have some pretty elderly types in our church I want to do my best to protect