Reply to: Some insights into US market (contracting)?

[WTFH]

3. 450 a day X 22.5 days that month has on average X 11 months (1 month off at least I would take or be with no work) = 111,375 GBP that it. Salary 8.6k, expenses 10k. Take home = 8.6k, ~6k for expenses (out of 10k expenses declared, 4k would be those that are really, really related to having UK like accountant, ltd insurance etc, and do not benefit me in anyway like say buying a Mac, which I would need regardless) and dividend (after tax) 58,786.73 = TOTAL 73,386.73 gbp for me. Tax all together 34%. *

* - assumption made that no other income is made (i do stock trading too as part time job) and contracts are outside or IR35 which are harder and harder to find day by day.

111,375 gbp equals to 146k usd. and 34% tax would (more less) federal + low income tax state + medicard. And... everywhere I been to in USA, felt way more expensive than Glasgow anyway. So this is why I came up with 140k, more or less. Obviously no income tax state will look even better. + from what I've read I can off set mortgage interest off my income in USA? On the downside, property taxes in USA...

You say that everywhere you've been to in the US felt "way more expensive" than Glasgow. Did you go to these places on holiday, or researching for options to live?

Maybe take a look at something like this to give you an idea of cost of living...
Cost of Living Comparison Between Glasgow, United Kingdom And Austin, TX, United States

[Drei]

1 - hahahaha not only did I fixed me teeth in Turkey but also did some other procedures. Turkey for medical tourism is best. I am literally in Turkey (Izmir) right now.

2- i found opposite



True, freelance that is what I am gonna call myself.

Also, it's not like I am moving there for money, but I am looking for a reason to move. I love Europe, to me its the greatest, most diverse in every way place in the world, gonna be far away from my family, I just want a good reason to justify this all. Taking part in visa lottery takes 5 minutes or less, so I never really thought seriously about moving there until now, when I actually have visa in my passport.

Anyway, got this opportunity so I am gonna use it. I will keep you all updated.

Again, thanks for your time and all the info!

Seriously, all the best and you'll have to PM me about Turkey, what you had done as I am looking into that too. In regards to #2 the only reason I mentioned it is cause we watch a lot of US TV and don't laugh but watched a few dating shows, stand-ups, MTV's girl code... and they do talk about it, seems to be that the majority get it snipped.


Gonna be honest, to me the reason that Europe is a bad place to live in, is because it is so diverse hence divided and every country has its own culture and history. Great place to visit, just bad to live and work. Look at the EU... the reason why only a few countries have the majority of economical migrants and the EU economy power houses is because there are no set rules across it. In the US every state is essentially its own European country with different rules/laws but still united, America is much larger than Europe anyhow. You have every climate and terrain you want, plus easy access to tropical holidays.



**Forgot to ask, did you use the same photo every year or did you change it? I just ran mine through one of them websites and it failed when I said that I used the same photo in previous years. I thought you can use a recent photo for at least 2 3 submissions. If I had to get a new one done every year then I didn't even had a chance to get picked and just wasted my time

[osterfelder]

Firstly, thanks for all your answers and suggestions. Ticket is bought now and I promise to coma back here in a year or so (when I have more knowledge and experience) to update you.

To vaguely answer your questions:
1. Yes, I've worked with lots of contractors from the US over the years
2. Yes, contracts in that range are possible, depending on qualifications, experience, etc.
3. Salaries vary, tell me how you came up with the figure of $140k gross as comparable to £450 per day
4. The US is a big country. You mentioned low-tax states, so if that's your driving factor, then look at low tax states. If you're interested in contracting and are happy to travel, then choose somewhere with good air connections.

3. 450 a day X 22.5 days that month has on average X 11 months (1 month off at least I would take or be with no work) = 111,375 GBP that it. Salary 8.6k, expenses 10k. Take home = 8.6k, ~6k for expenses (out of 10k expenses declared, 4k would be those that are really, really related to having UK like accountant, ltd insurance etc, and do not benefit me in anyway like say buying a Mac, which I would need regardless) and dividend (after tax) 58,786.73 = TOTAL 73,386.73 gbp for me. Tax all together 34%. *

* - assumption made that no other income is made (i do stock trading too as part time job) and contracts are outside or IR35 which are harder and harder to find day by day.

111,375 gbp equals to 146k usd. and 34% tax would (more less) federal + low income tax state + medicard. And... everywhere I been to in USA, felt way more expensive than Glasgow anyway. So this is why I came up with 140k, more or less. Obviously no income tax state will look even better. + from what I've read I can off set mortgage interest off my income in USA? On the downside, property taxes in USA...

Probably the most important consideration of all. Pick your state carefully. Lot's of people are leaving California because of federal + state taxes are just insane. My cousin among them recently decide to quit, taxes just punitive.

Hear good things about Texas.

Yes for me it's either gonna be Austin or Tampa. Been to both, hard choice. Tampa prettier, Austin better opportunities. I am trying to avoid California - high living cost and tax. (still tho contemplating Chicago as it's got so many opportunities)

I really hate you for this)) I have been applying for the last 10 years. This year I missed the boat. I really wanted to move over there as I have family and most of the contacts and friends I made contracting are all State side.

Out of curiosity, did you apply from the UK or EU? I am wondering if they don't like UK IP addresses.


WELL DONE!!!! for winning. I am extremely envious. I wish you all the best and I bet you will love it. Keep your account here and tell us of your personal experience.

Thanks, and no, I don't think IP counts at all. Most of my Scottish contracts were with limited onsite presence, so for the last 8 years I've literally been changing location/country every month or 2 (Photo Albums) It took me 7 years to finally win and I applied for the lottery from different countries. Successful entry was from Mexico.

@osterfelder

Out of curiosity, instead of asking the UK folk about life in the US, most of UK folk are very proud of their double tax system and the "free" NHS, don't you have any contacts out there you can reach out to? Might be worth talking to a recruiter in the US, get them to start looking for work. You can do remote interview and have a job on hand when you get there. This would also determine which state you would move to, and then look at properties if you want to buy or rent.

Just stating the easiest route I would go. I would reach out to all my contacts, family, friends and get them working for me, then sell all my assets here and just buy a house out right over there. You can't go there with the mindset of money, I need that much because I am used to that, that's the wrong attitude. Different living costs depending where you move. Overall you will have a lot more buying power after taxes than here. For example you buy things online from different states and you pay no VAT. I guess it has something to do with the litre of petrol being £0.50 pence.


Inheritance Tax, Capital Gains etc... completely different ball game, the allowance is in the millions of $. Married couples actually get benefits of being married, again not like in the UK where you are better off never declaring that your are living together since they treat you like 1 individual for tax purposes. Example, each person having a house, getting married at which point one of the 2nd homes becomes a secondary home and gets slapped with taxes.

Here you get suppressed to stay in your medium class lane. The moment you try and move out of it, you get slapped with so much Tax, you go right back in that middle lane, even further behind.




In regards to people living out of their cars, sure, I can say the same about London. If you spend all your money on going out, living the life you can't afford then what do you expect. Plenty of people in the UK living pay-check to pay-check, including £600pd contractors. I just read a post earlier about a contractor saying he is struggling, his war chest depleted putting stuff on credit card... how the hell you get to that stage? No idea as I never had this problem even during the recession when I was out of work for almost a year and still doing perm jobs. Only went contracting after the second redundancy. I always spent only what I could afford and never borrowed money from anyone. I wasn't spending £30 a day on coffee and food. LA, NYC just like London has a lot of young people having the need to show they have more, if you are a poser and a fake of course you are going to struggle.


I can tell you some salaries of people I know personally, my cousin who just finished University got picked up, trained to be a PM for a software house on a salary of $120k. Telephony engineer at $85k (Cisco, Shoretel and Skype). Have a look at US job sites and see what you can get.

Thanks for your suggestion, I will reach out to some people there too. "Plenty of people in the UK living pay-check to pay-check, including £600pd contractors." so true, met many, I always lived around 1k a month lifestyle and saved tons of money, but met many who hardly made it month to month and some had better day rates than I did, now they are in trouble while I am having beer on the beach in Turkey This is why I try and enjoy living minimalistic life.

Two things that no one mentioned:

1) If you don't have perfect teeth you might wanna go to Turkey or some place in Europe and get them babies fixed. If you do have perfect teeth you might wanna get them whitened so they glow in the dark You won't get that $150k+ a year salary if you don't have that American Smile.

2) If you are uncircumcised, you might wanna look into it. The first time you gonna be with a lady over there she might freak out.

1 - hahahaha not only did I fixed me teeth in Turkey but also did some other procedures. Turkey for medical tourism is best. I am literally in Turkey (Izmir) right now.

2- i found opposite

Whatever anyone says, no matter what argument they throw at you, you are miles better off in the states, as long as you are not a bum. Essentially being a consultant/freelance working for yourself is the American way and lots of people do it over there. Contractors in America are only construction contractors, so don't you say that you are one or worked as one)
You are a freelance consultant or whatever your title is.

True, freelance that is what I am gonna call myself.

Also, it's not like I am moving there for money, but I am looking for a reason to move. I love Europe, to me its the greatest, most diverse in every way place in the world, gonna be far away from my family, I just want a good reason to justify this all. Taking part in visa lottery takes 5 minutes or less, so I never really thought seriously about moving there until now, when I actually have visa in my passport.

Anyway, got this opportunity so I am gonna use it. I will keep you all updated.

Again, thanks for your time and all the info!

[Drei]

If you're middle class you likely have full health coverage and will only be out a deductible. Its the people who aren't quite poor enough to qualify for medicaid but don't get coverage(or really tulipty coverage) through work that get bankrupted. These people probably don't have much in terms of savings.

Personal lawsuits resulting in bankruptcy are not common either.

I think the Medicare over there is around $800 a month, but remember it goes out before you get taxed... so it is the same as paying for the NHS here

Your Medicare premiums, however, won't be taken out pretax. You'll need to deduct them when you file your taxes instead. This is the case even if you pay your premiums by having the money deducted from your Social Security retirement benefits check.

The only time you start paying tax on %50 of the benefits is if you get between $25k and $34k. Once it goes over $34k you pay tax on %85 of the benefits. So in principle, in the UK you get a tulipty private care paid by your work at £500 a year, and the tax man taxes that too.



Whatever anyone says, no matter what argument they throw at you, you are miles better off in the states, as long as you are not a bum. Essentially being a consultant/freelance working for yourself is the American way and lots of people do it over there. Contractors in America are only construction contractors, so don't you say that you are one or worked as one)
You are a freelance consultant or whatever your title is.

[Drei]

Two things that no one mentioned:

1) If you don't have perfect teeth you might wanna go to Turkey or some place in Europe and get them babies fixed. If you do have perfect teeth you might wanna get them whitened so they glow in the dark You won't get that $150k+ a year salary if you don't have that American Smile.

2) If you are uncircumcised, you might wanna look into it. The first time you gonna be with a lady over there she might freak out.

[jayn200]

I always imagine the US is great until you hurt yourself or fall ill then your entire life savings that you worked day after day to amass are gone in a blink. Or you get sued, and gone in a blink.

I was looking at job forums earlier, most jobs showing £30k-£40k, some £50k, then there was an american one for $200,000/year

IDK what to make of that except wtf

If you're middle class you likely have full health coverage and will only be out a deductible. Its the people who aren't quite poor enough to qualify for medicaid but don't get coverage(or really tulipty coverage) through work that get bankrupted. These people probably don't have much in terms of savings.

Personal lawsuits resulting in bankruptcy are not common either.

[FIERCE TANK BATTLE]

I always imagine the US is great until you hurt yourself or fall ill then your entire life savings that you worked day after day to amass are gone in a blink. Or you get sued, and gone in a blink.

I was looking at job forums earlier, most jobs showing £30k-£40k, some £50k, then there was an american one for $200,000/year

IDK what to make of that except wtf

[Andy2]

permie jobs are quite lucrative in silicon valley. its not uncommon for techies to earn half a million dollars in big techs

[Drei]

@osterfelder

Out of curiosity, instead of asking the UK folk about life in the US, most of UK folk are very proud of their double tax system and the "free" NHS, don't you have any contacts out there you can reach out to? Might be worth talking to a recruiter in the US, get them to start looking for work. You can do remote interview and have a job on hand when you get there. This would also determine which state you would move to, and then look at properties if you want to buy or rent.

Just stating the easiest route I would go. I would reach out to all my contacts, family, friends and get them working for me, then sell all my assets here and just buy a house out right over there. You can't go there with the mindset of money, I need that much because I am used to that, that's the wrong attitude. Different living costs depending where you move. Overall you will have a lot more buying power after taxes than here. For example you buy things online from different states and you pay no VAT. I guess it has something to do with the litre of petrol being £0.50 pence.


Inheritance Tax, Capital Gains etc... completely different ball game, the allowance is in the millions of $. Married couples actually get benefits of being married, again not like in the UK where you are better off never declaring that your are living together since they treat you like 1 individual for tax purposes. Example, each person having a house, getting married at which point one of the 2nd homes becomes a secondary home and gets slapped with taxes.

Here you get suppressed to stay in your medium class lane. The moment you try and move out of it, you get slapped with so much Tax, you go right back in that middle lane, even further behind.




In regards to people living out of their cars, sure, I can say the same about London. If you spend all your money on going out, living the life you can't afford then what do you expect. Plenty of people in the UK living pay-check to pay-check, including £600pd contractors. I just read a post earlier about a contractor saying he is struggling, his war chest depleted putting stuff on credit card... how the hell you get to that stage? No idea as I never had this problem even during the recession when I was out of work for almost a year and still doing perm jobs. Only went contracting after the second redundancy. I always spent only what I could afford and never borrowed money from anyone. I wasn't spending £30 a day on coffee and food. LA, NYC just like London has a lot of young people having the need to show they have more, if you are a poser and a fake of course you are going to struggle.


I can tell you some salaries of people I know personally, my cousin who just finished University got picked up, trained to be a PM for a software house on a salary of $120k. Telephony engineer at $85k (Cisco, Shoretel and Skype). Have a look at US job sites and see what you can get.

[Drei]

Hello,

I lived most of my life in UK, my whole family is there too, but since I was born in other euro country, i qualified for US diversity lottery and, greencard sticker is now inside my passport. Im planning to move to "somewhere" in USA beginning of January.

I really hate you for this)) I have been applying for the last 10 years. This year I missed the boat. I really wanted to move over there as I have family and most of the contacts and friends I made contracting are all State side.

Out of curiosity, did you apply from the UK or EU? I am wondering if they don't like UK IP addresses.


By the way, starting salaries for IT engineers are around $75k. Most of the people I know that have equivalent experience as I do have salaries of $150k+ In addition the taxes in the US are much lower than in the UK, the more you earn the less you pay, well up to $500k. Up to $500k you pay %28 (this is on average since it starts at %10 and goes up to around %35 when you get to $523,600), less if you earn less of course. On $164,900 you will pay around %20, just need to work out the average since you have the %10, %12, %22 and %24 brackets to go through. Beats %40 any day no??
You get a lot more value for your money, cost of living is cheaper and quality of life is better. Before you state that it is so expensive to live in the US go on a property site and check out how much a massive house costs compared to UK. Unless you want to live in Scotland any decent house in the UK is around £500k, see what you can get in the US for $660k.
Everyone in the US is treated as self employed which is amazing for anyone that contracted and knows their finances, expenses etc.
Sure you pay for healthcare but for a couple it is much cheaper than paying for the NHS, and you don't need to wait a month for your next GP appointment, and you might actually live by their proactive health system. I am talking about their yearly full health checks and other benefits which you don't get in the UK. Here they wait for you to get sick before they do anything. Please don't say it isn't so... personal experience.
You actually have the right to defend yourself, you know, as in carry some kind of defensive weapon/item that is not deemed illegal. Maybe go camping carrying a knife without having the fear of God that you will get arrested because it is a locking knife or slightly longer than "3. Meanwhile criminals to whatever the **** they want.

When my uncle came to the UK, he told us "wow you guys have a hard life"... that is for middle class. He went to the US in 1995, he settled in Las Vegas, his job wasn't very glamorous, engineer electronics, and yet he managed to buy 3 houses. His house is like a damn dream.
When I was in the US with work in Ohio, everyone I visited from work lived in mansions compared to our houses. My heart remained there and I truly wish I was more decisive.

Sure... if you want to live Central NY it will be like London, even LA has amazing properties at around $500k.

I got hitched in UK, but I always regretted doing so and wished I went over there, stay with the family and find someone over there. If it wasn't for ******* COVID there is a high chance I would have separated and left the UK to move there... but alas.

Every person I know that moved to the US and worked hard have great quality of life. I only know one person that won the lottery, went there and came back to UK after about 2 years, to stay on income support and council house... yep... you wanna be a parasite then don't go there. Parasites die over there, here they strive.


WELL DONE!!!! for winning. I am extremely envious. I wish you all the best and I bet you will love it. Keep your account here and tell us of your personal experience.

[SueEllen]

But then you meet the love of your life in the US and bang, your plans change. It does happen.

qh

Especially as you have a British accent which oddly Americans think is sexy....

[quackhandle]

- I'm single, not planning family for a while of ever, like to travel so in between contracts I get some months off.

But then you meet the love of your life in the US and bang, your plans change. It does happen.

qh

[Paddy]

I have worked in the USA, I am not sure what I was expecting but it turned out much the same as working in London, but more.

There were Indian teams, that had blagged more on their CV's, I suspect most had not even gone to Uni, previous occupation may have been street vendor.

I am not sure about the high wages, some of the junior guys were paying for McDonalds with their credit card.

Top guys were paid ok, but their real money came in bonus.

I was working for an American company in Germany and was sent to USA on SME visa. German contract was no overtime, when I came back, I had to take 6 weeks holiday. Expect to work long hours with no notice. Make sure you have hourly contract not day rate.

Also, DCM (Don’t Come Monday) is a thing, seen it done. Some people try to hide on Friday afternoon.

It was an interesting experience, and it didn't cost me, as I was given a new car, apartment with pool and access to the jet.
But if you were going alone you would need a few k to get you through the first few months.

Rents are very high in Silcone Valley, most of the people working in Starbucks sleep in their cars.

Interesting point. My nephew got his Phd in software whatever thing from Berkley. He started working in LA on $100,000 pa but need daddy to pay for housing. It's not cheap living there.

When I did my US stint, they threw in an apartment and car for the duration. On the plus side, anyone from the UK is treated like a genius.

[northernladuk]

Some of the engineers in Silicon Valley live in campers in the carpark.

I thought we have contractors that do that at Vodafone? Must be a lot easier paying parking in dollar bills rather than pound coins though.

[DoctorStrangelove]

Rents are very high in Silcone Valley, most of the people working in Starbucks sleep in their cars.

Some of the engineers in Silicon Valley live in campers in the carpark.