Reply to: Advice on Terminating Consultancy Agreement with my Client

[SussexSeagull]

Seems like it would be easier to hand in, and work your 2 weeks notice.

Sure, you hate them, I get it.

But not getting paid, having to chase a claim for non payment etc will probably still be quite stressful for you, even though it is a relatively simple process.

Plus you can have a little satisfaction of "work to rule" and do the bare minimum of effort and communication with them.

I'm not in your position of course.

There is a lot to be said for doing this. You are on your way out. Do your hours, smile sweetly then go. With any luck they will terminate you early.

[courtg9000]

Might want to get a doctors note for the leave citing ill health owing to work just in case!

[jmo21]

Seems like it would be easier to hand in, and work your 2 weeks notice.

Sure, you hate them, I get it.

But not getting paid, having to chase a claim for non payment etc will probably still be quite stressful for you, even though it is a relatively simple process.

Plus you can have a little satisfaction of "work to rule" and do the bare minimum of effort and communication with them.

I'm not in your position of course.

[northernladuk]

Just a quick question – I gave notice as per the terms of the agreement which are 2 weeks, I also then gave limited availability within these 2 weeks (The agreement states I will have autonomy over my days, hours, location and methods etc) and there are no time scales in the works order, There also are no agreed minimum days to be worked etc, It only states a 12 month period but no agreed minimum or maximum days etc, There is nothing.

Doesn't matter how much glitter you sprinkle on it you are likely in breach and are certainly not meeting clients expectations so it's no wonder they are hacked off. Taking holidays or sick after putting your notice in is a pretty clear action to avoid your obligations of notice. If it did go to court they'll see through it. You wouldn't have taken the time off normally, it's only prompted by the notice so likely they will side with the client. It won't get to that but just pointing out how the client will see it.

The client wanted to have a 30 minute call this morning, I politely requested if we could have any communication specifically related to the Consultancy Agreement/Works Order/Handover in writing so I had a clear record of any communication and paper trail of what has been said, discussed, agreed etc– The client not surprisingly has again acted very hostile demanding a call, The reason I don’t want/feel comfortable agreeing to a 1-1 call is that we had one on Friday, where the client spent the whole time accusing me of X,Y,Z without evidence or merit, attacking me personally and making me feel very very uncomfortable, I’ve spent the weekend feeling physically and mentally sick, haven’t eaten or slept and I don’t want any undocumented contact as everything so far has been completely twisted.

To be fair , to the client, it looks like you are acting like a dick. You give notice, refuse to work that notice and then get crappy with them over meetings. It's hardly surprising they aren't happy. That said bullying you and being nasty about it is bang out of order. Being unhappy with a contractual situation and a heated discussion but still come to an agreement is the worst it should be. That said, you have technically breached so court is the worst but it just won't come to that. Not in anyone's interest at all. They certainly should not be making you feel like this but when you do this to clients you've got to expect some form of blow back.

Where do I stand? I feel like I am being treated like a child, but I do not want another 1-1 undocumented call to receive any more “abuse”.

You are being treated like a supplier that's breached contract and then got all shirty about meetings. The trust and respect has completely broken down. Again though, that shouldn't be a reason for bullying and threats or whatever they've done to you. Looks like you picked a pretty unreasonable client but it can happen.

Where do you stand? Normally I'd say you've messed them about, it's gonna be rough for a few days and everyone will get over it. Personally I'd probably just not go in again and refuse to respond to any email or phone call. Effectively leave now and have done with it. They'll get upset but they'll move on. If it's affecting you this badly then just wash your hands of it all until it blows over.

That said, you've got the issue of being paid. As I said previously, when you breach, or even piss the client off but not breaching it's likely they'll withold payment for any time worked. I hope not, it would be nice if companies can be fair about this but they sometimes aren't. Probably worse if there is an agent in the loop as they are more aggressive chasing their lost revenue. But as as I said to the other poster, expect to have problems getting your money. If you don't happy days but forewarned is forearmed.

[SussexSeagull]

You have served notice and won't be changing your mind. If they insist on talking to you then sit there and repeat a variation of that for 30 minutes.

[ladymuck]

Maybe ask an independent third party to attend the call to listen in? State that you have asked a mediator to attend to ensure that the call is constructive.

[willendure]

Hello,

Just a quick question – I gave notice as per the terms of the agreement which are 2 weeks, I also then gave limited availability within these 2 weeks (The agreement states I will have autonomy over my days, hours, location and methods etc) and there are no time scales in the works order, There also are no agreed minimum days to be worked etc, It only states a 12 month period but no agreed minimum or maximum days etc, There is nothing.

The client wanted to have a 30 minute call this morning, I politely requested if we could have any communication specifically related to the Consultancy Agreement/Works Order/Handover in writing so I had a clear record of any communication and paper trail of what has been said, discussed, agreed etc– The client not surprisingly has again acted very hostile demanding a call, The reason I don’t want/feel comfortable agreeing to a 1-1 call is that we had one on Friday, where the client spent the whole time accusing me of X,Y,Z without evidence or merit, attacking me personally and making me feel very very uncomfortable, I’ve spent the weekend feeling physically and mentally sick, haven’t eaten or slept and I don’t want any undocumented contact as everything so far has been completely twisted.

Where do I stand? I feel like I am being treated like a child, but I do not want another 1-1 undocumented call to receive any more “abuse”.

Well done on serving notice.

I cannot see that you under any obligation to accept a call. Maybe just drop them an email saying you are uncomfortable about having a call because previously you have not been treated respectfully and leave it at that. Unless you actually want to get on the call and make a recording of them insulting you so that you can keep it on file - doesn't sound to me like you are up for that.

[Snooky]

You can record audio or video calls. Perhaps you can agree to a short call as long as they agree to remain civil and professional, but let them know you'll be recording it.

There are free call-recording apps for both Android and iPhone. You can record a Teams call and it even auto-generates a transcript for you.

Before the call, prepare details of what you want to say, what you think they will say and how you will respond. Keep it completely calm and civil. If they start getting rude or aggressive, politely remind them of the conditions for the call. If they continue, hang up.

You should always remain professional even if they don't, but you certainly aren't being paid to tolerate abuse.

[AWMHouse]

Hello,

Just a quick question – I gave notice as per the terms of the agreement which are 2 weeks, I also then gave limited availability within these 2 weeks (The agreement states I will have autonomy over my days, hours, location and methods etc) and there are no time scales in the works order, There also are no agreed minimum days to be worked etc, It only states a 12 month period but no agreed minimum or maximum days etc, There is nothing.

The client wanted to have a 30 minute call this morning, I politely requested if we could have any communication specifically related to the Consultancy Agreement/Works Order/Handover in writing so I had a clear record of any communication and paper trail of what has been said, discussed, agreed etc– The client not surprisingly has again acted very hostile demanding a call, The reason I don’t want/feel comfortable agreeing to a 1-1 call is that we had one on Friday, where the client spent the whole time accusing me of X,Y,Z without evidence or merit, attacking me personally and making me feel very very uncomfortable, I’ve spent the weekend feeling physically and mentally sick, haven’t eaten or slept and I don’t want any undocumented contact as everything so far has been completely twisted.

Where do I stand? I feel like I am being treated like a child, but I do not want another 1-1 undocumented call to receive any more “abuse”.

[northernladuk]

The Consultancy Agreement states the below,

4.3
The Supplier shall perform the Services. The Supplier shall endeavour to co-operate with the Client’s reasonable requests within the scope of the Services however it is acknowledged that the Supplier shall have autonomy over its working methods, hours and location.

For example, If there is scheduled or arranged Training to be delivered with a Partner of my client, I will absolutely agree to be on-site whether this is in their office, at a retailer, trade partner or whatever the requested location is providing I have enough realistic notice, and this hasn't been an issue for me and I will regularly attend on-site as agreed, however the issue is that when there isn't specific Training taking place or an on-site visit, I will still be expected to attend the office 3 days a week on general fixed days to match the existing team, I have generally done this without complaint to try to work to the clients routine, however the client has then challenged me quite aggressively for sharing with a permanent colleague that I generally work 8-4 (within the office hours which are either 8-4/9-5) and that I was there as a self employed contractor - The client told me I shouldn't be discussing my work set-up with anyone, which is ridiculous as for example I have a contractor pass and people ask me what I'm doing etc and what my days/hours are.

It's likely not the first time you'll see this freelancing either. The client will often just want some working doing to fill a temporary hole. It's easier to get a freelancer/contractor in that to recruit so even though they've taken you on a true freelancer the expectation from them was always a temp employee. There are some good clients, and there are bad ones and it looks like you've caught a bad one from the off. But it won't be the last time you'll be seen as a pseudo employee. At least next time you know what questions to ask in interview to try avoid/identify it.

Yes I understand this could be the case, This is my first time Freelancing and to be quite honest - It was a role that was originally advertised as FTC, however during the interview process they suddenly kept pushing for me to accept but as a Freelancer because it was the only way they could meet my salary expectations as apparently the budget was cut during the recruitment process, It all seemed a bit suspicious at the time, especially as they also initially offered me a lower day rate based on working 260 days which means I'd of had no factored in annual leave or sickness etc, It was only when I queried it that they agreed to a revised higher amount and based on 227 days to factor in the annual leave I wouldn't have compared to if the contract had been FTC.

So here is your problem. They advertised for an FTC and that is their expectation but they've fudged the actual engagement type to fit an agenda. To them you are and always have been an FTC. With FTC being a contract of employment they that's how the've treated you. Always have to be careful when something morphs in to something else but expectations don't catch up. It's one of the main reasons IR35 hit us. Client expects temporary permie but engagement is fudged to an outside role and HMRC jump on it.

They are actually a large client, £2.2bn turnover, however the division I am working for within the business is quite a small brand/function of the wider business, and a small team where absolutely everything is micromanaged to the point I've been told how I should and shouldn't speak in meetings - Something I've never experienced in 16 years of working, however the actual client is large.

Well this might help your payment options. If it's big enough they may just pay it without buggering about withholding anything.

Thank you, This is difficult for me as they currently owe me 21 days and I really need the income, I've only had to give notice on the agreement as they've been so unreasonable I cannot continue. I did a HMRC questionnaire and it came back with they have treated me as an employee and I should send this to them, but I'm not sure how helpful that will be.

It might help if it's a big org and they just shuffle paper rather than wanting to spend time arguing over 21 days. All you can do now is get your notice in, stop working, get your timesheets in and wait. If it goes silent then google 'dunning' and just start sending them a lot of letters and mails until they cave in and pay.

[sadkingbilly]

That said, some of my more enjoyable contracts have been at clients where the permanent staff are in total revolt.

IME ,most permies are revolting

[SussexSeagull]

Oh yes the irony, I have experienced similar, however I'm convinced the companies actually pay to be nominated!!

That said, some of my more enjoyable contracts have been at clients where the permanent staff are in total revolt.

[SussexSeagull]

Thank you for your advice, I have added the below where possible to help with the context of my situation while I digest all of the information and responses.



Thank you for your reply and input.

All a bit unusual, to be honest. A FTC switching to a Contract isn't unheard of (or vice versa) but I don't recall hearing of anyone being a genuine freelancer in my getting on two decades of contracting.

Sounds like you are desperate to get out for your own health, and if that is the case do so, but if you want to play hardball then turn round and tell them you will be following the contract and deciding where best to work and wait for them to either shut up or terminate you.

[AWMHouse]

What always did my head in is the worst contract I had was at a client who won awards for being a good employer.

Oh yes the irony, I have experienced similar, however I'm convinced the companies actually pay to be nominated!!

[AWMHouse]

Thank you for your advice, I have added the below where possible to help with the context of my situation while I digest all of the information and responses.

Snooky has hit the nail on the head so all your answers are in that post. I'll expand a bit more for reading later once you've got it sorted and you are in a better place.


You sure it's a sole trader? Not a LTD? Are you via an umbrella or anything like that or do they pay you gross directly? - I am a Sole Trader, I am not using an Umbrella company, and the client pays me gross directly via Invoice, which I then will report via HMRC self-assessment in the usual way.

It's definitely outlined in black and white in the contract? It seems odd to have such an open working situation when you are delivering training which tends to be at prescribed times in the office etc. If you were using your own materials and the like I can see you could just rock up, deliver and go but being in the office and shift times seems weird.
That said it's not unusual for clients to treat you like a perm. Even in the old days of being outside IR35 there was an expecation and a level of professional courtesy to work to the clients routine. It didn't make you any less of a business if you agreed to be on certain sites between certain times. Very rare you could swan in and out when you wanted to regardless of clients working environments. Obviously there are situations where flexibility was agreed and a poor client manager just doesn't get it and treats you like one of their own. I think we've all had this at some point. Sometimes you have to suck it up but your situation definitely appears to have overstepped that level of courtesy and spiralled out of controle. - The Consultancy Agreement states the below,

4.3
The Supplier shall perform the Services. The Supplier shall endeavour to co-operate with the Client’s reasonable requests within the scope of the Services however it is acknowledged that the Supplier shall have autonomy over its working methods, hours and location.

For example, If there is scheduled or arranged Training to be delivered with a Partner of my client, I will absolutely agree to be on-site whether this is in their office, at a retailer, trade partner or whatever the requested location is providing I have enough realistic notice, and this hasn't been an issue for me and I will regularly attend on-site as agreed, however the issue is that when there isn't specific Training taking place or an on-site visit, I will still be expected to attend the office 3 days a week on general fixed days to match the existing team, I have generally done this without complaint to try to work to the clients routine, however the client has then challenged me quite aggressively for sharing with a permanent colleague that I generally work 8-4 (within the office hours which are either 8-4/9-5) and that I was there as a self employed contractor - The client told me I shouldn't be discussing my work set-up with anyone, which is ridiculous as for example I have a contractor pass and people ask me what I'm doing etc and what my days/hours are.

It's likely not the first time you'll see this freelancing either. The client will often just want some working doing to fill a temporary hole. It's easier to get a freelancer/contractor in that to recruit so even though they've taken you on a true freelancer the expectation from them was always a temp employee. There are some good clients, and there are bad ones and it looks like you've caught a bad one from the off. But it won't be the last time you'll be seen as a pseudo employee. At least next time you know what questions to ask in interview to try avoid/identify it.

Yes I understand this could be the case, This is my first time Freelancing and to be quite honest - It was a role that was originally advertised as FTC, however during the interview process they suddenly kept pushing for me to accept but as a Freelancer because it was the only way they could meet my salary expectations as apparently the budget was cut during the recruitment process, It all seemed a bit suspicious at the time, especially as they also initially offered me a lower day rate based on working 260 days which means I'd of had no factored in annual leave or sickness etc, It was only when I queried it that they agreed to a revised higher amount and based on 227 days to factor in the annual leave I wouldn't have compared to if the contract had been FTC.

I'm guessing this is a small client? I've worked in small businesses and it can be very cutthroat and intense. They don't have big departments to hide in and everyone is wearing multiple hats with responsibilities beyond their role.

They are actually a large client, £2.2bn turnover, however the division I am working for within the business is quite a small brand/function of the wider business, and a small team where absolutely everything is micromanaged to the point I've been told how I should and shouldn't speak in meetings - Something I've never experienced in 16 years of working, however the actual client is large.

Snooky's advice is spot on. Just hand your notice in and don't go back. Don't answer your phone or respond to emails as it will just cause you more anxiety. They won't be happy and it sounds like they will try and take it out on you. Just quit.
On the legal side just for discussion though, yes you do have to give them two weeks notice else be in breach. Technically going on holiday or being off sick doesn't cut it as it's obviously a sham to get around the two week notice. So yes you will be in breach but there is nothing they will do about it except cause agro but that will die off very quickly. I assume there should be something in the contract about holidays so I doubt booking two weeks of and disappearing will make one iota of difference. You'll get just as much grief so do as Snooky says. - There isn't anything in the agreement about holidays, or even agreed working days or hours, Only that I will provide services for a certain period of time, It's all pretty lose.

You will probably have to kiss your last payment goodbye though. You are in breach so likely they will withold it. This is illegal though. They should pay you for your time and then sue you for breach later. This never happens. Possession is 9/10ths the law so they'll keep the money in lieu. You are more than in your right to go to small claims for it but from evidence on here no one ever does. It's a long messy process and not sure if they'll respond in kind regarding breach. We've many posts similar to this and the end result is the contractor walking and just giving up the last payment. It's worth it just to be out of the situation and move on usuall. - Thank you, This is difficult for me as they currently owe me 21 days and I really need the income, I've only had to give notice on the agreement as they've been so unreasonable I cannot continue. I did a HMRC questionnaire and it came back with they have treated me as an employee and I should send this to them, but I'm not sure how helpful that will be.

As I said before, not uncommon, particularly in small outfits. We've been fighting IR35 for 15+ years because clients have been doing this to us so a difficult area. Sometimes you get a bad apple and you have to just move on. Nothing you can do about it.

I asked about how you are being paid earlier which 'might' make a difference. If it's the client paying you directly then I am afraid it's likely you'll not see that without a legal fight which it doesn't sound like you are up for at the moment. It sounds to me that just forgetting it and getting out of the nightmare is the best out though.
But you all you can do is quit first, get your personal wellbeing sorted and then see what happens. Expect no payment so get it ready in your head what you want to do if that eventuallity hits.

Thank you for your reply and input.