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Previously on "Do I need to provide a sick note to end client if I am caught inside IR35?"

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  • northernladuk
    replied
    Bit of a odd turn of events from a fairly legitimate question about contractual process of notification of absence which is only an issue for contractors to how to act professionally when sick which affects absolutely everyone in the world with a job.

    We called out the client for acting inappropriately but as with many of these the other half of the story has come out and it appears now the OP has made a rod for their own back and almost forced the client to take action because they've not done what any professional person would have. Nice to see both sides of an issue for a change and certainly puts a different light on it.

    Leave a comment:


  • eek
    replied
    Originally posted by ladymuck View Post
    Does no-one use out of office notifications any more?
    It's more that people ignore them and the fact that because you are ill, outlook says you are out today but still around tomorrow so they just shift what would be a 5 minute call into a short con-call the following day.

    Doing X rarely fixes a problem it just transforms issue A into issue B as people work around your illness in a way that is for their benefit and not yours.

    Leave a comment:


  • ladymuck
    replied
    Does no-one use out of office notifications any more?

    Leave a comment:


  • eek
    replied
    Originally posted by NotAllThere View Post
    I do this this as permie, never mind as a contractor!
    Unless you are dead (or near enough) you keep just enough eye on things that nothing goes wrong. Which does mean 30 seconds in the morning forwarding meeting requests to a suitable replacement with an apology added or requesting postponement. It's really not difficult.

    Leave a comment:


  • NotAllThere
    replied
    Originally posted by northernladuk View Post

    What's wrong with that? If I was off sick, unless I was on my deathbed, I'd be advising I'm not in and outline what is outstanding to make sure the work continues smoothly. Even if you call in day by day you can give a 5 day update so they can plan around you.
    I do this this as permie, never mind as a contractor!

    Leave a comment:


  • Whorty
    replied
    Originally posted by northernladuk View Post

    What's wrong with that? If I was off sick, unless I was on my deathbed, I'd be advising I'm not in and outline what is outstanding to make sure the work continues smoothly. Even if you call in day by day you can give a 5 day update so they can plan around you.

    This is one of the areas I think contractors need to be a step above perms, even if you are inside IR35. You are a supplier, not a bod on site so if you've a commitment to a client you've got to go above and beyond to ensure you don't interrupt a clients work.

    You are well enough to post on here so you are well enough to check what you were supposed to be doing and advise the client.
    This .... if I was your client and saw you posting on here, I'd be well miffed.

    Leave a comment:


  • northernladuk
    replied
    Originally posted by Willy Win View Post
    Just got a text from her asking whether there are any meetings that need covering today.... obviously she thinks "I'm not well so not working" means I'm still logging in and reading emails and checking my diary
    What's wrong with that? If I was off sick, unless I was on my deathbed, I'd be advising I'm not in and outline what is outstanding to make sure the work continues smoothly. Even if you call in day by day you can give a 5 day update so they can plan around you.

    This is one of the areas I think contractors need to be a step above perms, even if you are inside IR35. You are a supplier, not a bod on site so if you've a commitment to a client you've got to go above and beyond to ensure you don't interrupt a clients work.

    You are well enough to post on here so you are well enough to check what you were supposed to be doing and advise the client.

    Leave a comment:


  • WTFH
    replied
    Originally posted by Willy Win View Post
    Just got a text from her asking whether there are any meetings that need covering today.... obviously she thinks "I'm not well so not working" means I'm still logging in and reading emails and checking my diary
    That would be the professional thing to do - check what you have on and let your manager know.
    Or, take the other option of "I'm well enough to post on the internet and send texts, but not well enough to do a 5 minute check on my calendar"

    Leave a comment:


  • Willy Win
    replied
    Just got a text from her asking whether there are any meetings that need covering today.... obviously she thinks "I'm not well so not working" means I'm still logging in and reading emails and checking my diary

    Leave a comment:


  • psychocandy
    replied
    No way at all....

    None of their business. The brolly is your employer in any case. Its not as if they're paying you anyway...

    If I'm sick, which is never, I let the client know AS A COURTESY. Thats it. No sick notes.

    I had an agent like this once, who use to refer to the contractors as "her people". Then she'd want thinks like sick notes and holiday requests which she said she had to authorise!!! (Even tried to tell me once I couldnt have 2 weeks off even though client was ok with it - i.e. didnt want 2 weeks on non-billing more like!)

    I said no. Client was ok. As long as I cleared time away with them they were happy so nothing else mattered.

    Leave a comment:


  • eek
    replied
    Will she be signing a timesheet and paying you for the time off work.

    If not then send this to her

    Temporary change to fit notes


    For Statutory Sick Pay (SSP), if you go off sick on or after 10 December 2021 your employer can only ask you for proof of sickness, such as a fit note, after 28 days of sickness (including non-working days).

    When do I need a fit note? - NHS (www.nhs.uk)

    Also remind her that your employer is the umbrella you work through - you should be telling the umbrella who should tell the agency who then should be telling the end client but you are shortcutting that for politeness.

    Finally NotAllThere it only takes a second to use google and get upto date information - that's what I did.

    It's not being 7 days since March 2020 and the period is constantly(ish) changing.
    Last edited by eek; 5 January 2022, 07:58.

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  • NotAllThere
    replied
    Originally posted by northernladuk View Post
    It's highly likely she's been swamped with people claiming covid but don't have it. I know loads of people wagging it with the covid card when they haven't so it's a real thing.
    Like this you mean?


    She has no right to request a sick note unless you are an employee of the client. In order to receive SSP from your brolly you will need to have been sick four consecutive days, have a fit note (aka sick note, don't ask me why), and notify the brolly within 7 days of becoming unwell. It's all here:

    https://www.contractoruk.com/umbrell...0be%20eligible.

    Just reply to her that since she's not your employer or a representative of your employer (the brolly), it would be inappropriate for you to send the fit note to her, but you will of course be sending one to the umbrella company. You don't want to lose that 50p a day, or whatever it is.

    Leave a comment:


  • northernladuk
    replied
    Are you still at the same client from September? It's interesting to note you mentioned covering for sick when you posted about it.

    https://forums.contractoruk.com/busi...hing-goes.html

    Even if it's not you can see what I mean about pulling a sickie to get out of the notice that is mentioned in there. She's probably been burned by this before and is pushing the issue.

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  • northernladuk
    replied
    What does your contract with the brolly state? If there are any notes to be passed about it should be to the brolly and they will deal with the client. There is usually something in employment contracts about sick notes for sickness over 5 days or summat.

    It's an odd situation though. It's highly likely she's been swamped with people claiming covid but don't have it. I know loads of people wagging it with the covid card when they haven't so it's a real thing. I'd imagine she's had enough of it and you are the first one to cop for her annoyance. I wouldn't get too annoyed. It's all the other idiots that are spoiling it for you so not totally her fault.

    But as you are employed by the brolly and on their clients site I'd check the contract you have with the brolly and speak to them. Let them take it up with her. You have no contractual relationship with them so shouldn't have to supply anything to them. It should be done through the proper chain if anything.

    If she's busting your chops about it then just advise her you are looking in to the proper process with the brolly and will be back to her as soon as you know.

    Leave a comment:


  • Do I need to provide a sick note to end client if I am caught inside IR35?

    I have been off work with a bad case of the flu/ sickness for the past 2 days and texted in to client manager to let her know each morning that I'm not well enough to work. However this afternoon she replied stating that if I take further time off this week that I must obtain a sick note.

    In previous contracts via my limited company working outside IR35 I have never been asked for this (albeit I have rarely taken any time off sick during a contract in the last few years). However, now operating through an umbrella company and inside IR35, as an "employee" of the brolly do I have to supply one? I feel that her tone in her response implies she does not believe that I am unwell which is frankly annoying as I wouldn't just take time off like this for fun when I can't bill for it.

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