Reply to: Contracts with NHS have always been crap but not this bad!

[anonymouse]

Good luck with that.

Fair play to 'them' (who's Them?) for looking to cough up.

The NHS

[simes]

Good luck with that.

Fair play to 'them' (who's Them?) for looking to cough up.

[anonymouse]

2 weeks in and they want to start paying me, we'll see how much and for how long next.

[edison]

Just looking at a US org chart (not a bank)... a Director is level 6.
1. President/CEO
2. Executive Vice President
3. Senior Vice President
4. Vice President
5. Senior Director
6. Director
7. Senior Manager
8. Manager
9. Senior Analyst/Developer/Support
10. Analyst/Developer/Support
11. Junior Analyst/Developer/Support
(12. Intern)

So you are basically at director before you start looking at jobs that included actually management beyond being a Team Lead...

Those of you who are quoting org structures from banking are off the mark when I mentioned an Assistant Director role in the context of the NHS. That role reported to the CIO. That's a fairly senior management role.

My current client is a London council. The CIO is at Assistant Director level. All the other Assistant Directors report into the Executive Directors which makes up most of the equivalent of the Board.

I could never understand American job grades, I've known people who claimed to be at VP level in investment banking who seemed barely past managing a few BAs.

[jayn200]

My business cards from the USA firm I work for have me down as Managing Director, There are only 2 people above me, one is 'Principal' and the other is 'Chief Technology Officer' so maybe not a typical USA company...

Is this professional services? Or what is it?

MD is most industries is same as ceo or reporting directly into ceo if they have both.

[SussexSeagull]

I seem to remember a lot of Directors in a company I used to work for suddenly becoming Vice Presidents when they started going to conferences in America as it got them better hotel rooms!

[darmstadt]

Just looking at a US org chart (not a bank)... a Director is level 6.
1. President/CEO
2. Executive Vice President
3. Senior Vice President
4. Vice President
5. Senior Director
6. Director
7. Senior Manager
8. Manager
9. Senior Analyst/Developer/Support
10. Analyst/Developer/Support
11. Junior Analyst/Developer/Support
(12. Intern)

My business cards from the USA firm I work for have me down as Managing Director, There are only 2 people above me, one is 'Principal' and the other is 'Chief Technology Officer' so maybe not a typical USA company...

[SussexSeagull]

Thankfully, the VSO, and the countless other organisations who organise such, seem to have enough people who think otherwise for them to remain in operation.

To each their own. But for my own, if I had done enough, and got enough, then if any of my skills could be put to use somewhere without funding, then I am up for it.

VSO volunteering is abroad and is for organisations that wouldn't be employing people (at least not for the foreseeable future). The NHS do employ people and engage contractors. While it is entirely your choice anyone who works for free is offering them an incentive to do this less.

[WTFH]

So you are basically at director before you start looking at jobs that included actually management beyond being a Team Lead...

Yes, pretty much.

And most levels below director, the difference is either length of service or salary, very little difference in actual day-to-day work.

There are people with the title "Senior Manager" or "Manager" and they don't actually manage anyone.

[eek]

Just looking at a US org chart (not a bank)... a Director is level 6.
1. President/CEO
2. Executive Vice President
3. Senior Vice President
4. Vice President
5. Senior Director
6. Director
7. Senior Manager
8. Manager
9. Senior Analyst/Developer/Support
10. Analyst/Developer/Support
11. Junior Analyst/Developer/Support
(12. Intern)

So you are basically at director before you start looking at jobs that included actually management beyond being a Team Lead...

[WTFH]

Why? In your typical US investment bank job title inflation probably makes that middle manager an Executive Senior Vice President.

Just looking at a US org chart (not a bank)... a Director is level 6.
1. President/CEO
2. Executive Vice President
3. Senior Vice President
4. Vice President
5. Senior Director
6. Director
7. Senior Manager
8. Manager
9. Senior Analyst/Developer/Support
10. Analyst/Developer/Support
11. Junior Analyst/Developer/Support
(12. Intern)

[eek]

True, but my example of an Assistant Director is surely a fair bit above what most people think of as a middle manager?

Why? In your typical US investment bank job title inflation probably makes that middle manager an Executive Senior Vice President.

[edison]

Probably from the Express or Mail. There is a big gap between Assistant Director and an Executive Director. Less so between Assistant Director and a job title that includes Director, but isn't an Executive Director.

True, but my example of an Assistant Director is surely a fair bit above what most people think of as a middle manager?

[The Bona Fide]

*NHS Volunteer* 3rd Line Support Engineer - Cardiff Wales - August-26-2020 (IPBrV)

FREE basically.....

I thought TATA had offered up all their furloughed staff for nothing?!

[simes]

I am a left leaning supporter of a well funded at the point of use NHS but I don't think people who have spent years learning skills should be expected or asked to work for free. For no other reason if the NHS start doing it then other worthy organisations will start doing it followed by not so worthy organisations.

It is a terrible precedence.

Thankfully, the VSO, and the countless other organisations who organise such, seem to have enough people who think otherwise for them to remain in operation.

To each their own. But for my own, if I had done enough, and got enough, then if any of my skills could be put to use somewhere without funding, then I am up for it.