• Visitors can check out the Forum FAQ by clicking this link. You have to register before you can post: click the REGISTER link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. View our Forum Privacy Policy.
  • FREE webinar: What does a post IR35 reform CV look like? : Mon, May 10, 2021 7:15 PM - 8:15 PM BST More details here.

When the client has no concept of IR35....

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Originally posted by Cid View Post
    Something that i struggle with is the idea that "inside or outside" is going to be all down to the wording of the contract.
    It's not, and the fact that you think it is means you've not done much reading on the subject.


    Is this 2 day contract directly with the client or via an agency?


      Originally posted by Cid View Post

      I know....that why i'm trying to prepare myself.
      i do listen to some of the stuff you say hence i have been building up the warchest and taking minimal money so that if things come to the worst i'm in a better place to weather the storm.
      All you've done is prep your money. You've not done anything to try understand what you do let alone keep on top of the changes coming which is now on it's third iteration over the space of four years. Your warchest is not gonna be much good if you don't have a clue what you do as a job and push yourself in to relying on it because you've put yourself out of work.

      I'm really not trying to be rude but this thread is really piss poor. What is it, third or fourth time telling you how far behind you are and in reply you've picked an 8 year old article and talked about your war chest. This is stuff you should know and if you don't you should have enough common to go find it. Every contractor has to do this bar non. Why on earth do you have such little knowledge of it and are unable to go find more?

      There is a link on the right that called IR35 let alone this whole forum area plus a million resources on it on the web. Is it any wonder HMRC things we aren't businesses and should be taxed like employees when you come along with this level of knowledge?

      Something that i struggle with is the idea that "inside or outside" is going to be all down to the wording of the contract.
      When QDOS reviewed the first contact their advice was to alter the wording of a single line in the contract.
      is that really all that is going to win the argument with HMRC ?
      Of course it's down to the wording of the contract. That's where the terms of engagement are laid out. Can you RoS, is there no MoO and D&C. If it's not there there is no evidence you are outside so fail the test. Issues around simple wording are only solidifying the position ie. RoS must be unfettered so the detail is key there. QDOS are just giving their review on the finer points and making it perfect. That one word doesn't make one outside or inside.
      All that said at the end of the day it's down to the working conditions which is why you NEED to know IR35. Whatever it says in the contract the client manager may try to treat you like a perm and ignore the clauses in which case YOU need to correct them and put it right. If you don't have a clue how are you supposed to do that you will be destroying your own status.

      Obviously i ask this knowing that many questions are still up in the air.
      and maybe no one is really going to know until the waters are tested after April.
      No you don't you need to go read up and come back questions later. Questions don't teach you things, they clarify them. And we don't know but if you have a solid understanding of IR35 and then the changes you'll be in a much better place. You'll certainly know if you are really inside and what to do about it (an appeals processes exists and has been discussed). You are waiting to be told what to do which is the fundamental problem you have. Yes we don't know exactly what will happen about illegal blankets, appeals and retro investigation but we do know what it means when your client says you are inside and why.

      Where as this change is a complete nightmare for most of us I think it's an absolute god send for you. Get yourself an inside status and just carry on not having to worry about IR35.
      Last edited by northernladuk; 23 February 2021, 15:29.
      'CUK forum personality of 2011 - Winner - Yes really!!!!


        Originally posted by Cid View Post

        They have more than 50 Staff.
        So no.
        It's a bit more complicated than that. Take a look here:
        April 2021 changes to off-payroll working for clients - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)

        The rules apply to all public sector clients and private sector companies that meet 2 or more of the following conditions:
        • you have an annual turnover of more than £10.2 million
        • you have a balance sheet total of more than £5.1 million
        • you have more than 50 employees
        I.e. if they meet the conditions for turnover and balance sheet then the number of employees is irrelevant, and you're still responsible for the determination.