IR35 caught contactor wins holiday pay from HMRC

[mudskipper]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/tax/news...ployment-case/

Behind paywall - IPSE write up here - https://www.ipse.co.uk/our/news-list...e-member-.html

This is great news - PS bodies cannot judge an engagement to be that of deemed employment, then dodge the obligations of the employer.

Great news for Susan, bad news for off payroll tax.

[ladymuck]

You'd hope that key users of contractors in the private sector take note that this could happen to them if they allow the IR35 reforms in.

[DaveB]

You'd hope that key users of contractors in the private sector take note that this could happen to them if they allow the IR35 reforms in.

You'd hope that HMRC would take notice since this directly affects every IR35 caught contractor currently for them. I suspect that's why they settled out of court just before the case began. The last thing they want is precedent being set formally.

[ladymuck]

it still annoys me immensely that IR35 blames the contractor when, for the most part, hiring companies don't want to take on employees because it costs them more in taxes and providing benefits. If they truly want independent freelance experts, why do they fail to treat their contractors in that way?

All that messing about with training, pensions, sick pay, having to follow proper disciplinary processes when you want to try and get rid of Susan in Accounts because although she does her job well you really hate that little grunting noise she makes, finding a way to make people redundant when you want to offshore a job. Why bother when you can take on a freelancer and chuck them in the river like a six month old puppy when the post-Christmas novelty has worn off?

[mudskipper]

it still annoys me immensely that IR35 blames the contractor when, for the most part, hiring companies don't want to take on employees because it costs them more in taxes and providing benefits. If they truly want independent freelance experts, why do they fail to treat their contractors in that way?

All that messing about with training, pensions, sick pay, having to follow proper disciplinary processes when you want to try and get rid of Susan in Accounts because although she does her job well you really hate that little grunting noise she makes, finding a way to make people redundant when you want to offshore a job. Why bother when you can take on a freelancer and chuck them in the river like a six month old puppy when the post-Christmas novelty has worn off?

Just to clarify that grunting Susan in accounts is definitely not the Susan in the article

[FIERCE TANK BATTLE]

Be a laugh if she signed off with stress for 3 weeks...

[Mordac]

You'd hope that key users of contractors in the private sector take note that this could happen to them if they allow the IR35 reforms in.

I'm not sure they have any (or much, depending on how "big" they are) say in the matter.

[northernladuk]

Be a laugh if she signed off with stress for 3 weeks...

She'll be able to do them for unfair dismissal if they try bin her while she is off as well.

[Fred Bloggs]

On the other hand, where companies are already very wary of engaging contractors because they are concerned about claims for holiday pay, pensions etc.... This makes it even more likely that the default model contract in the future is far more likely to be a FTC arrangement. One where you are quite definitely an employee for a fixed period of time on the company salary structure. That way, the "proper contractors" who would never dream of such claims are denied yet another potential client. Just one more step along the road to the end of the industry as it has been known for the last few decades. Notable that your supposed "friends" are effectively throwing you all under the IR35 bus.

[DeludedKitten]

On the other hand, where companies are already very wary of engaging contractors because they are concerned about claims for holiday pay, pensions etc.... This makes it even more likely that the default model contract in the future is far more likely to be a FTC arrangement. One where you are quite definitely an employee for a fixed period of time on the company salary structure. That way, the "proper contractors" who would never dream of such claims are denied yet another potential client. Just one more step along the road to the end of the industry as it has been known for the last few decades. Notable that your supposed "friends" are effectively throwing you all under the IR35 bus.

FTC is pretty much inside IR35 with some rights. So if the role is inside IR35 then maybe this is the best way for you to work.

If a client offered me an FTC worth my day rate, I'm not sure I'd be too fussed about turning that down when I'd be busy counting the money.

But in the same way, I'd take an inside IR35 role if the financials make sense - have done in the past, would do again.