Results of the public sector consultation is up

[eek]

The main concern in all of this is retrospective investigations. If they now decide I've been in ir35 for 10 years I will literally have to declare bankruptcy.

+1 anyone working on a contract that continues beyond April has a great big target on their back and meets HMRCs new rules of targeting easily identifiable groups (and this group will be both easily identifiable and people are going to asking what are you doing about them)...

[cojak]

The main concern in all of this is retrospective investigations. If they now decide I've been in ir35 for 10 years I will literally have to declare bankruptcy.

Then dump the contract you're in now and jump into a newly available PS contract using a brolly. That's what I would provided it was local and a reasonable rate).

[DaveB]

Actually you are not thinking about it correctly. If a contractor walks out of TFL because they are trying to push everyone into a brolly then there are lots of new roles available. Its then down to you as a new supplier to pursue a suppliers rate that is attractive enough to go inside IR35 for that period.

+1 on this.

Those PS roles will still need to be filled. Anecdotally there are reports of clients realizing they are going to have to pay more to get the right people so for those who got out early they could be plenty of opportunities in PS roles if the rates are right.

I have no issues working inside IR35, or going brolly for those gigs provided the rate reflects the circumstances.

The ones who really need to worry about this are those who will still be in the same gigs under the same working arrangements after the changes come in.

[confusion]

Public Sector Agent - Switch to PAYE boys and girls.....

Here's an interesting statement from my public sector agent - a suggestion that PAYE is the way forward and perfectly safe to change without retrospective action!

==========================

Hello,

I write again to provide a further brief update in connection with the forthcoming change to the Off-Payroll reform ("IR35") Legislation.

As most of you will be aware, the Government brought forward a change in the law surrounding off-payroll reform. agent are currently working in partnership with client to look in detail as to how this may affect us moving forward beyond April 2017.

There is little for me to add to my previous message at this stage - there will be no change to how you continue to engage with agent and client on your assignment. Whilst we acknowledge that there have been a number of rumours going around the site about what will and will not be the case beyond March of this year, we would like to remind all ASW's that you have the right to a PAYE contract. I am specifically aware that an unfounded rumour is circulating that taking this approach will automatically trigger an IR35 investigation into your past business affairs. For an indication of what your PAYE rate would be, please feel free to contact the site-office.

Please be assured that we will be in contact with you again in due course when we are able to provide a more conclusive update. In the meantime, we continue to work with client and our legal teams to establish a long-term solution that works for all parties. If you have any further questions or queries at all, please do not hesitate to contact me or the site-office.

================================

[daemon]

Your call. Bearing in mind everyone in the PS will be making a conserted effort to leave around April, to say there are going to be slim pickings in an understatement.

Oh aye. I'm looking out now, however as i said the field i am in, contracts tend to not come up terribly often, but when they do they are decent enough and tend to last quite a while.

So if i get another gig between now and the end of March then fantastic. Its Adios Amigos to the PS client i'm with now. BUT, if i dont, then i dont particularly want to jump ship with nothing to go to and risk being on the bench for months.

Hence being within IR35 in my current role (until such times as i get a non PS gig) would be more preferential than no contract at all. (Half a cake is better than no cake, etc).

So, my thinking is jump soonish into a PAYE environment, which my agency will facilitate (Reed), hence by the cut off date i'm already inside IR35 and thus theoretically not subject to the "test" come April, and the ensuing "list" that might generate to HMRC.

[daemon]

+1 anyone working on a contract that continues beyond April has a great big target on their back and meets HMRCs new rules of targeting easily identifiable groups (and this group will be both easily identifiable and people are going to asking what are you doing about them)...

My understanding is as follows - "anyone contractor operating via a limited company on 6th April will be subject to the new test to be published by HMRC".

If you move into a PAYE agreement with your agency or an umbrella company BEFORE that date, then surely that removes the requirement to have your contract tested, and thus surely lessens the risk of being on a "list" with HMRC for prospective follow up / investigation?

[seeourbee]

Not quite - see Para 15 of the technical note

[eek]

Oh aye. I'm looking out now, however as i said the field i am in, contracts tend to not come up terribly often, but when they do they are decent enough and tend to last quite a while.

So if i get another gig between now and the end of March then fantastic. Its Adios Amigos to the PS client i'm with now. BUT, if i dont, then i dont particularly want to jump ship with nothing to go to and risk being on the bench for months.

Hence being within IR35 in my current role (until such times as i get a non PS gig) would be more preferential than no contract at all. (Half a cake is better than no cake, etc).

So, my thinking is jump soonish into a PAYE environment, which my agency will facilitate (Reed), hence by the cut off date i'm already inside IR35 and thus theoretically not subject to the "test" come April, and the ensuing "list" that might generate to HMRC.

My concern would be that HMRC will look at 2 things.

1) How you were paid in April 2017 onwards
2) how you were paid before then - paying particular attention to the agency sending your NI details to HMRC through the agency reporting tool...

It may well be that HMRC won't look at the PS department you are in and go yep check retrospectively but rather they may look at the agency reporting side of things and go same agency so chances are same end client lets investigate (I also suspect but don't quote me on this as I have no insider knowledge that the agency payment reporting system is the easiest data set to cross reference)....

Now if you are on payroll directly with Reed it won't be a problem (you will disappear from the reports and won't be an issue) if you use an umbrella you may not be any better off...

[cojak]

Here's an interesting statement from my public sector agent - a suggestion that PAYE is the way forward and perfectly safe to change without retrospective action!

==========================

Hello,

I write again to provide a further brief update in connection with the forthcoming change to the Off-Payroll reform ("IR35") Legislation.

As most of you will be aware, the Government brought forward a change in the law surrounding off-payroll reform. agent are currently working in partnership with client to look in detail as to how this may affect us moving forward beyond April 2017.

There is little for me to add to my previous message at this stage - there will be no change to how you continue to engage with agent and client on your assignment. Whilst we acknowledge that there have been a number of rumours going around the site about what will and will not be the case beyond March of this year, we would like to remind all ASW's that you have the right to a PAYE contract. I am specifically aware that an unfounded rumour is circulating that taking this approach will automatically trigger an IR35 investigation into your past business affairs. For an indication of what your PAYE rate would be, please feel free to contact the site-office.

Please be assured that we will be in contact with you again in due course when we are able to provide a more conclusive update. In the meantime, we continue to work with client and our legal teams to establish a long-term solution that works for all parties. If you have any further questions or queries at all, please do not hesitate to contact me or the site-office.

================================

..and I take you back to my response in the other thread.

He doesn't know anymore than we do and he's trying to stem mass resignations.

If he's so confident that there'll be no investigations get him to guarantee against them.

[cojak]

Oh, and the next thing I'm expecting is agents* coming on the forum telling us that we are being reckless in our 'loose talk' because it's costing them money.

It's every contractor for themselves guys, we'll do what's right for us.

(*Mr H being the honourable exception.)