HMRC Enquiry letters on Loans from EBT and other schemes

[contractor1985]

An appeal seems the obvious way forward.

We need to know what is required to appeal, would you then have to provide full details of loans which may be higher then the amount being requested?!

There seems to be multiple options:

Mark Boardman at Cobham Murphy
Somebody at TaxTalkUK

I note from a long running thread in yahoo groups that somebody named Michael J Perry FCA seems to be heavily involved and is providing updates.

Anyone else to consider?

Everyone using the same option is obviously the best approach.

[DonkeyRhubarb]

An appeal seems the obvious way forward.

We need to know what is required to appeal, would you then have to provide full details of loans which may be higher then the amount being requested?!

It's best you get professional advice on the exact wording of the appeal but basically it will be just stating that you wish to appeal and that you disagree that the loans are income.

Take it one step at a time. Wait to see what HMRC come back with after you have appealed.

Don't bother trying to second guess what HMRC will do, otherwise it will do your head in. Trust me, I've been there and done that over the past 10 years.

[administrator]

An appeal seems the obvious way forward.

We need to know what is required to appeal, would you then have to provide full details of loans which may be higher then the amount being requested?!

There seems to be multiple options:

Mark Boardman at Cobham Murphy
Somebody at TaxTalkUK

I note from a long running thread in yahoo groups that somebody named Michael J Perry FCA seems to be heavily involved and is providing updates.

Anyone else to consider?

Everyone using the same option is obviously the best approach.

Michael posts on here occasionally as well:
View Profile: Michael J Perry FCA - Contractor UK Bulletin Board

Send him a PM if you need to contact him.

[KnightRider]

I didn't think that TRM was an EBT, but you can find more on this thread.

Talent Resource Management

I think everybody who went to TRM should read this. It will give us bit of history of TRM and the problems they had. I also would like to hear from Michael J Perry FCA regarding these new letters.

[Vallah]

If anybody who is worried about the 08/09 letters, (especially those who can't get in touch with old providers) would like a suggested reply to HMRC, I'd be happy to provide some wording. I'm not interested in touting for new business so don't need to know anybody's real name, but obviously this advice would be given on the understanding that anybody using it does so off their own bat, and that I can't be held responsible yada yada, and you should seek proper professional advice etc etc.

If the mods think this isn't OK then feel free to remove my post.

[cojak]

HMRC Enquiries on Loans from EBTs.

That's fine Vallah.

Thanks.

[EBTContractor]

Advantage Accounts / Edge Consulting

hi, has anyone spoken to Advantage Accounts?

I used to be with Edge..

[Emigre]

If anybody who is worried about the 08/09 letters, (especially those who can't get in touch with old providers) would like a suggested reply to HMRC, I'd be happy to provide some wording. I'm not interested in touting for new business so don't need to know anybody's real name, but obviously this advice would be given on the understanding that anybody using it does so off their own bat, and that I can't be held responsible yada yada, and you should seek proper professional advice etc etc.

If the mods think this isn't OK then feel free to remove my post.

A generous offer. Reputation point given.

[LandRover]

Need to read this...

http://www.taxbar.com/Finance_No3_Bi...Soares.pdf.pdf

COMMENCEMENT AND TRANSITIONAL PROVISIONS
The commencement and transitional provisions are generous and are contained in paragraphs 47 – 52 of Schedule 1 of the consultation draft.
The general rule is the new provisions have effect in relation to relevant steps taking place on or after 6th April 2011.

There are two exceptions to this.

If on or after 9th December 2010, but before 6th April 2011, the EBT, for example, pays a sum of money to the employee within s.554C(1)(a) then a charge under the new legislation arises. That charge, however, is reduced or eliminated by any amount repaid to P by the employee before 6th April 2012 (paragraph 48(4) Schedule 1).
There is a similar relief if the loan has been made by another party (say a bank) to the employee between 9 December 2010 and 5 April 2011 and the EBT has provided security for the loan; if that structure is unravelled before 6th April 2012 then even though the new loan was taken out on or after 9th December 2010 and before 6th April 2011 the charge is cancelled out.

If later a pre-9th December 2010 loan reaches its repayment date and it is continued there would still be no charge because there will not have been any payment of a sum of money to a relevant person (employee) on or after the 6th April 2011 (s.554C(1)(a)).

The monies would have been paid over when the original loan was made. They are not paid over again. Section 554(1)(e) states that references to a payment of a sum of money include (in particular) references to the payment of a sum of money by way of a loan. There still has to be a payment of a sum of money. Even if the alteration in the arrangement results in a new loan there would have been a re-financing without a payment of a sum of money.

HMRC in MacNiven v Westmoreland 73 TC 1 acknowledged that one may be able to re-finance without new payments being made.

Lord Hoffmann at 75E stated:-
“Mr McCall (Counsel for HMRC) does not contend that payment must involve a negative cash flow which is not compensated by a cash flow in the opposite direction. He accepts, for example, that many commercial refinancing operations discharge old debts and create new ones without any cash flow either way.”
Of course, a loan by an EBT to an employee made on or after 9th December 2010 and before 6th April 2011 must be repaid, if this legislation is to be avoided, before 6th April 2012.

[EBTContractor]

Keep us posted please mate.. i've also contacted them via email tonight... only just got the nasty turd coloured envelope!!

For those seeking contact details for Edge Consulting:

http:// edge-resourcing.com

0845 2870400
07624 427650

I have both written and left a VM for them this morning, enquiring into the level of support being offered and as to whether this is a general process in place to follow.