Churchill Knight & Boox clients being investigated as Managed Service Companies

[mudskipper]

I received a letter this morning from HMRC so I’m learning all about this double quick!

Strangely I have been notified as a client of Churchill Knight?? I’d never heard of them before today. I have only ever used Boox, and closed the company in 2020 anyway.

Can anyone explain why HMRC think I’m a client of CK?? From all my research there is no connection between boox and CK.

is this a HMRC cock up I could use in my appeal?

I'm no expert and you should definitely get professional advice, but if they've notified you as a client of CK, and you're not, I'd say that the notice is invalid. As they have to serve notices before 7 April for the 17/18 year, if I were you I wouldn't rush to tell them before then!

[GregRickshaw]

Just joined this site and forum as I am likely caught up with this. I am with Boox, and they have told me that I am on HMRC's list to be investigated. I haven't received an official letter as yet but I am doing all the prep for my appeal just as if one had arrived.

Anyway, I am going to get the legal stuff & net income calculation professionally & independently checked out early next week. It has given me a little bit of hope after a very stressful week.

DO NOT wait for one to arrive! Chase chase chase... if you have been told by Boox you are on the list then chase them.

You have to do this immediately as the deadline is 30 days from when the letter was issued.

Do not take CK's (and Boox's probably) vernacular as gospel 'HMRC may allow appeals to those who did not get the letter.' The letter is pretty brutal in it's demands and they have 100% refused any kind of settlement.

Your calculations will be needed when we go to appeal on our own at the moment though we are caught/being dealt with as a collective.

It's not an IR35 investigation in name, but it is a IR35 capture by association and we need to be ready to fight our cases eventually.

[SwissSaffa]

It isn't me who is saying that.

No, I don't believe the entire industry is at retrospective risk.

It's your responsibility as a company director to understand all the legislation that applies to running a small Ltd Co. Ignorance is no defence of the law. I have zero sympathy for anyone who claims they weren't fully aware of the MSC legislation.

Good luck with it, truly. It's so sad that when I gave up on the UK contracting industry several years ago, I knew then it was basically stuffed. Yet HMRC seem to have turned the MSC legislation into something far more dangerous than anyone ever thought. The exemption in the legislation for accountants appears to have been set aside. It's truly tragic for caught individuals and also for the entire UK economy when an entire vibrant wealth creating, tax paying industry is attacked into oblivion. Really a very sad day indeed.

yeah this is exactly why I moved to Switzerland. Everything just works here and if you provide a valuable service, you get paid a butt load for it and you don’t have hmrc breathing down your neck and brexit knocking you down. I suggest you all come to Zurich. We get paid about 1.5 to 3 times more than in London and we need IT workers here, the economy is growing massively.

[GregRickshaw]

I'm no expert and you should definitely get professional advice, but if they've notified you as a client of CK, and you're not, I'd say that the notice is invalid. As they have to serve notices before 7 April for the 17/18 year, if I were you I wouldn't rush to tell them before then!

Yes get legal advice that kind of cock-up may be able to invalidate the demand... so get expert legal advice.

Remember in the background though we only have 30 days from the issue date and given that notices started arriving around 17th March, it's getting close to the deadline now.

[Fred Bloggs]

yeah this is exactly why I moved to Switzerland. Everything just works here and if you provide a valuable service, you get paid a butt load for it and you don’t have hmrc breathing down your neck and brexit knocking you down. I suggest you all come to Zurich. We get paid about 1.5 to 3 times more than in London and we need IT workers here, the economy is growing massively.

Spot on. I gave up on the UK industry for the latter years of my working life and retired from a job earning 3x what I'd have got in the UK. Without even asking, I was even rewarded with a £100k after tax pay off for my efforts when I finally put my laptop away.

My only regret is that I didn't leave 20 to 30 years earlier than I did. I wouldn't have come back.

[Fred Bloggs]

I received a letter this morning from HMRC so I’m learning all about this double quick!

Strangely I have been notified as a client of Churchill Knight?? I’d never heard of them before today. I have only ever used Boox, and closed the company in 2020 anyway.

Can anyone explain why HMRC think I’m a client of CK?? From all my research there is no connection between boox and CK.

is this a HMRC cock up I could use in my appeal?

Be careful. That's likely a clerical error. You could get another letter with Boox referenced once you have told them the facts. But I believe you do have to tell them. This might be a sad case of damned if you do, damned if you don't. Get expert advice first thing on Monday.

[SwissSaffa]

It isn't me who is saying that.

No, I don't believe the entire industry is at retrospective risk.

It's your responsibility as a company director to understand all the legislation that applies to running a small Ltd Co. Ignorance is no defence of the law. I have zero sympathy for anyone who claims they weren't fully aware of the MSC legislation.

Because apart from a brief piece of work now - initial appeal, nothing is going to happen for years - while they (I suspect) charge a monthly fee.

everuone wants a slice of a “big group” style cash flow

I contacted Qdos about this months ago and first thing they said was “your tax liability plan does not cover msc” yay so nice that I stuck with them for all these years. Slime.

[Fred Bloggs]

I contacted Qdos about this months ago and first thing they said was “your tax liability plan does not cover msc” yay so nice that I stuck with them for all these years. Slime.

My god. They used to come here and boast about their track record. I guess nobody ever claimed until now then. As a matter of interest, what does the very small print on the policy terms say? It must say something if MSCs are explicitly excluded?

[tenten]

I contacted Qdos about this months ago and first thing they said was “your tax liability plan does not cover msc” yay so nice that I stuck with them for all these years. Slime.

Hmmm that would be unwelcome news for many policy holders. The policy does explicitly cover disputes over self-assessment and PAYE but I guess they might have scope to wriggle out of this if it is painted as an MSC specific dispute/discovery...... the effect of which is a deemed payment (PAYE) and self-assessment dispute.

[speyps]

Just joined as I've been notified by Boox that I'm caught up in all of this.

Can anyone advise what address HMRC are using for this delightful correspondence? Is it company registered address (which in my case would be the Boox office). Thanks.