what happened to free speech

[Gibbon]

Hmm, yes, but was the enlightenment in the sciences not somewhat inspired by the Renaissance, where classical ideas gained traction again in Europe? Were the enlightenment philosophers not to some extent building on the work of classical philosophers? I don't know though, I'm not the classicist here.

I would agree, but the achievements in the Renaissance, with the venerable exception of Da Vinci were mainly confined to religious themes albeit with a humanist slant taking an increasing role. Some suggest that it was the meeting of the Greek orthodox and catholic churches in Florence in the early 15th century that was a catalyst. The council was meant to be in Rome but delays etc meant it was rearranged. The Greek clergy brought with them a library of ancient texts which Lorenzo etc took to with earnst and a mad scramble started trying to find more in the monestries all over europe.

The reading of Plato and Cicero had a profound effect when people realised that the Church wasn't the only source of wisdom and had infact tried to suppress the ancient sources.

[Gibbon]

Oh dear, here we go. Why not pick out the bits from religious books about the world being built in six days, or 5 fishes and 2 loaves feeding thousands of people, or on dying one gets 72 virgins to oneself?

I didn't say the Bible, or the Koran. Not literally at least. Most of the stories in there are just metaphors anyway.

I'd have thought it was obvious in the context I wrote it, following the post about what the the vicar said, that I was referring to the message being taught, like loving thy neighbour, not stealing, and other things that make people better people. If those teachings are spread due to religious beliefs, then that is showing religion in a good light.

I respectively disagree.

Christianity has had neigh on 2000 thousand years to convince of it's
doctrine and it's thankfully a failed experiment. Yes there are moral lessons in it's scriptures but those come with a heavy price in terms of superstitious baggage and threats of eternal damnation.

I think with we should be learning how to teach moral guidance unfettered by superstition. If the ancients could do then so should we. Philosophy is the most apt for this.

[Doggy Styles]

I respectively disagree.

Christianity has had neigh on 2000 thousand years to convince of it's
doctrine and it's thankfully a failed experiment. Yes there are moral lessons in it's scriptures but those come with a heavy price in terms of superstitious baggage and threats of eternal damnation.

I think with we should be learning how to teach moral guidance unfettered by superstition. If the ancients could do then so should we. Philosophy is the most apt for this.

Whooosh!

[Spacecadet]

I respectfully disagree

[NotAllThere]

I respectively disagree.

Christianity has had neigh on 2000 thousand years to convince of it's
doctrine and it's thankfully a failed experiment...

Failed? There's far more Christians in the world than there are atheists. It's the biggest religion on the planet! If that's failure, I'd be fascinated to hear what a success would be like.

"nigh", btw.

[Gibbon]

Failed? There's far more Christians in the world than there are atheists. It's the biggest religion on the planet! If that's failure, I'd be fascinated to hear what a success would be like.

"nigh", btw.

Thanks for the spelling lessons all.

You're being disingenious.

The decline in the seats of Christian power is there to see.

Take Anglican, do more people go to church in London than not even discounting the faithful of other religions?

Take Catholic, do more people go to church in Rome than not?

[speling bee]

I respectively disagree.

Christianity has had neigh on 2000 thousand years to convince of it's
doctrine and it's thankfully a failed experiment. Yes there are moral lessons in it's scriptures but those come with a heavy price in terms of superstitious baggage and threats of eternal damnation.

I think with we should be learning how to teach moral guidance unfettered by superstition. If the ancients could do then so should we. Philosophy is the most apt for this.

There are not just moral lessons. Modern thinking about the limitations to be placed on nations consucting a war stem to a great extent from Christain just war theory. I am sure there are other examples.

I do think, however, that religion has largely played its part in human development, but at times it still plays an important role. Some great men have been inspired by religion. One of my favourites is Camilo Torres Restrepo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[sasguru]

Failed? There's far more Christians in the world than there are atheists. It's the biggest religion on the planet! If that's failure, I'd be fascinated to hear what a success would be like.

"nigh", btw.

In the big scheme of things, humans are young and under-developed, latecomers to the universe; only in the last 400-500 years have a small proportion of them started to understand their environment.
It is not a surprise then that the vast majority are mired in ignorance and superstition, their understanding of cause and effect poor in the extreme.
Thankfully there is a small, but growing, cognitive elite: atheists, ready to slowly lead the rest of you from your infantilism* and fairy tale beliefs.

Changed childishness to infantalism, it's more accurate.

[NotAllThere]

Thanks for the spelling lessons all.

You're being disingenious.

The decline in the seats of Christian power is there to see.

Take Anglican, do more people go to church in London than not even discounting the faithful of other religions?

Take Catholic, do more people go to church in Rome than not?

Nobody denies that religion is in decline in Europe. Christianity is still a big deal in the States, and very much so in South America and Africa. That will continue to be the case so long as "...the vast majority are mired in ignorance and superstition."

It's "disingenuous", by the way. Maybe you should attempt to stick to words you know the meaning of?

[Spacecadet]

Thankfully there is a small, but growing, cognitive elite: atheists, ready to slowly lead the rest of you from your childishness and fairy tale beliefs.

I'm sure this uprising will be put down in due course.
Hopefully you get an opportunity to repent before the facing the ultimate test.