The shape of things to come....

[GreenerGrass]

Good posts from Dodgy and Ardesco.

I think the so called 'liberal intelligentsia' who opened this Pandora's box couldn't give a stuff when it was cruddy Northern working class slums or Slough, etc. being taken over (until recently traditional Labour voters would still vote Labour whatever) and Islamified. But when pretty historic English towns are going down the toilet even they will start thinking "what have we done?"


And Denny, there is a difference between
a) buying an investment property in another country and supporting yourself financially
b) turning up with nothing and expecting them to house, support, educate and care for your family of 10 when you or most of your family barely speak their language, and hold their culture, beliefs and values in contempt.

[milanbenes]

I think you bunch of biggots need to go and take evening classes in cultural diversity

Milan.

[Ardesco]

I have recently bought a flat in Bulgaria but don't actually intend nor am I expected by the authorities to eat Yoghurt everyday and learn fluent Bulgarian. So why should a Muslim (extremists excluded who should be booted out) have to learn and speak English to feel safe and welcome in this country? It makes no sense at all.

I disagree with this point. Anybody who decides to emmigrate to another country should be forced to learn the national language. If I went to live in spain I would expect to have to learn to read and speak spanish to be able to live there. I would not expect the locals to translate everything into English for me because I can't be arsed to learn spanish.

If you want to emmigrate to a country that does not speak your language you should bloody well learn it. How much money do we waste translating everything into different languages because "It's only fair....". If you can't be bothered to do something as simple as learn the language you shouldn't be entitled to anything IMHO.

We should have an English test as a requirement to get into this country*, anybody that fails it needs to go back home and learn how to use our language before they are welcome here. This doesn't mean that they can't talk to each other in thier own language whenever they feel like it, it does mean that they should be able to understand everything and make themselves understood when they are living and working over here.

(This is not specifically aimed at muslims either before the PC lot start screaming at me, this goes for anyboy of any race/colour/creed that decides to emmigrate to any country)

*Obviously this is for immigration, not tourism before anybody starts with the smart comments

[BrowneIssue]

We should have an English test as a requirement to get into this country

Or Welsh, of course.

[Xenophon]

And Denny, there is a difference between
a) buying an investment property in another country and supporting yourself financially
b) turning up with nothing and expecting them to house, support, educate and care for your family of 10 when you or most of your family barely speak their language, and hold their culture, beliefs and values in contempt.

Correct.

[Ardesco]

Or Welsh, of course.

I would agree, but Britain is an english speaking country. The Welsh have thier own language (Which was dead until about 10-15 years ago when they decided to make up a bunch of new words and try and get it back into the mainstream, and a very good job they have done too) which is fine, but until devolution (if it ever happens) they are still part of Britain and as such should have the same English requirement as everybody else in Britain.

As an aside did you know that some words in welsh and sanskrit are the same? Makes you wonder... Did a bunch of Welsh people move to India, or did a bunch of Indians move to Wales millenia ago? Or did two languages develop in parallel by coincidence? Secondly does that explain why some people who try to do an Indian accent in jest slip into a Welsh one?

[milanbenes]

I watched a documentary about bus drivers from the Ukraine who came to work in wales and drive buses and as part of getting residency permission they had to learn welsh

Milan.

[SallyAnne]

I disagree with this point. Anybody who decides to emmigrate to another country should be forced to learn the national language. If I went to live in spain I would expect to have to learn to read and speak spanish to be able to live there. I would not expect the locals to translate everything into English for me because I can't be arsed to learn spanish.

Yeah but this doesn't happen Ardesco.

My folks are emmigrating to Spain this year - they're not being forced to learn Spanish (they'd probably never get a chance to use it if they did!) It's English community after English comunity out there for them now.

I have friends who live in France who don't speak it very much, a brother who has emmigrated to Thailand who doesn't speak it (although he's learning to be fair)....the world is an open playing field for people - it's wonderful that people can pick and chose where they want to live!

Bravo The World

[Ardesco]

Yeah but this doesn't happen Ardesco.

My folks are emmigrating to Spain this year - they're not being forced to learn Spanish (they'd probably never get a chance to use it if they did!) It's English community after English comunity out there for them now.

I have friends who live in France who don't speak it very much, a brother who has emmigrated to Thailand who doesn't speak it (although he's learning to be fair)....the world is an open playing field for people - it's wonderful that people can pick and chose where they want to live!

Bravo The World

I'm shocked knowing how the French normally deal with people who don't speak French.....

Ask youself this though SA, do Thailand print everything in English and provide English translators to help you get by? Does France? Does Spain?

No?

Then why the hell do we???

I'm not saying the world shouldn't be an open playing field for people, however I do think that if you want to emmigrate the least you can do is learn the bloody language of the country that you are going to. Why have your parents not bothered tryign to learn Spanish? Is it beneath them? Do they not want to be able to integrate with the local population? If so why the hell are they going there???

[beaker]

Yeah but this doesn't happen Ardesco.

My folks are emmigrating to Spain this year - they're not being forced to learn Spanish (they'd probably never get a chance to use it if they did!) It's English community after English comunity out there for them now.

I have friends who live in France who don't speak it very much, a brother who has emmigrated to Thailand who doesn't speak it (although he's learning to be fair)....the world is an open playing field for people - it's wonderful that people can pick and chose where they want to live!

Bravo The World

Can anyone else spot the irony here? Immigrants (in this case the British) populating their own little enclaves in other countries, staying within their own communities, opening fish and chip shops, not bothering to speak the local language, imposing their loud music, events and custom and expecting these to be accepted by the locals... while I believe integration is the key, if its possible not to do it , people who can't be bothered won't integrate.

Anyway, back to more important matters in the Ask Beaker thread... we're currenlty discussing the rain and eating squirrels.