Parents encouraged to use large 4x4's by the government

[Paddy]

Most of the 3rd point looks like incontrovertible fact to me:

"they give their owners visibility and (in some circumstances) increased crash protection by increasing height and weight relative to others, consequently taking away visibility and safety from those others."

Absolutely not so. I have driven 4x4s and trucks. If you are having problems seeing brake lights of vehicles in front then you are tailgating or at least too close. 4x4s have much less visibility all round hence why the majority of accidents are done while reversing. 4x4 are far less stable than a car hence why they roll over easier.

The problems are not with the 4x4s, it is with the drivers of 4x4s particularly when it makes them feel big and powerful so they tailgate in order to intimidate. There should be a separate driving test for 4x4s.


[QUOTE=andy]4x4 driving is ok in America where they have wide roads
Not for Britain where we have narrow lanes called roads[/QUOTE

One would expect that to be so but in fact it is not. There is just as many problems with urban 4x4s in the USA especially on the school run. Over 300 school kids re killed each year outside school gates by 4x4s mainly while they are reversing.

[Numptycorner]

Absolutely not so. I have driven 4x4s and trucks. If you are having problems seeing brake lights of vehicles in front then you are tailgating or at least too close. 4x4s have much less visibility all round hence why the majority of accidents are done while reversing. 4x4 are far less stable than a car hence why they roll over easier.

I agree to a point on this, but, with cars you can see what is in front of the car and thereby have extra safety. When behind high sided vehicles you can't see if they are tailgatting or not, you can't rely on the brake lights as many seem to hit them every few seconds. You can't rely on somebody elses driving skills to guess it is safe. Even if you keep your distance it is harder to see.

[Ardesco]

One would expect that to be so but in fact it is not. There is just as many problems with urban 4x4s in the USA especially on the school run. Over 300 school kids re killed each year outside school gates by 4x4s mainly while they are reversing.

Thats horrible??? Isn't killing them once enough........

[Old Greg]

Thats horrible??? Isn't killing them once enough........

That must be why the 4x4 drivers reverse over them. Want to make sure they got 'em first time.

[dang65]

You can't rely on somebody elses driving skills to guess it is safe.

This is absolutely true. There was a tv campaign recently - might still be on - aimed at motorcyclists, basically telling them to watch out for other road users. Bikers on forums were up in arms about it. How could the government "blame" bikers for all these accidents. Why didn't the tv campaign concentrate on educating other road users to watch out for bikes.

Unfortunately, surviving on a motorbike, or a bicycle, or in a car on a motorway really requires you to assume at all times that all other road users are incompetent, drunk, drugged up, blind, never took a driving test, are half asleep, insane and suicidal. All of them, all the time.

[angusglover]

This is absolutely true. There was a tv campaign recently - might still be on - aimed at motorcyclists, basically telling them to watch out for other road users. Bikers on forums were up in arms about it. How could the government "blame" bikers for all these accidents. Why didn't the tv campaign concentrate on educating other road users to watch out for bikes.

Unfortunately, surviving on a motorbike, or a bicycle, or in a car on a motorway really requires you to assume at all times that all other road users are incompetent, drunk, drugged up, blind, never took a driving test, are half asleep, insane and suicidal. All of them, all the time.

Yep, IMHO bikers are far more aware of the driving conditions, have a greater appreciation of speed and generally are more alert than car drivers. I have done both and although you are at more risk on a bike, you really do appreciate just how bad some car drivers are!!!!

[chicane]

On my way to the sandwich shop this lunchtime, I stood at a zebra crossing and a *** **** **** in a Range Rover drove straight across. On my way back from the sandwich shop, I was stood at the very same crossing as a *** **** **** in a BMW X5 drove straight across.

These people need an attitude transplant.

[Chugnut]

Yep, IMHO bikers are far more aware of the driving conditions, have a greater appreciation of speed and generally are more alert than car drivers. I have done both and although you are at more risk on a bike, you really do appreciate just how bad some car drivers are!!!!

They are generally. You end up riding quite defensively and go on the assumption that every other driver hasn't seen you. That's why nine times out of ten if you have a biker coming up behind you whilst you're driving, and you move towards the kerb in an obvious movement (rather than just drifting about), the biker will thank you when they overtake.

Gravity and vulnerablity are your enemy when you're on a bike so every encounter with a car is to be treated with caution.

[Bluebird]

On my way to the sandwich shop this lunchtime, I stood at a zebra crossing and a *** **** **** in a Range Rover drove straight across. On my way back from the sandwich shop, I was stood at the very same crossing as a *** **** **** in a BMW X5 drove straight across.

These people need an attitude transplant.

are you sure it was a zebra crossing and not some spilt paint ?

[chicane]

are you sure it was a zebra crossing and not some spilt paint ?

Then there must be a great deal of paint spillage in this city. I stand by my original theory.