Things can only get better

[_V_]

https://www.theguardian.com/business...0s-say-experts

UK households could suffer the biggest annual decline in their living standards since the 1950s as the Russian invasion of Ukraine pushes up global energy prices, experts have warned.
With inflation already at the highest rate for 30 years, analysts said a sustained rise for wholesale oil and gas markets would further add to the squeeze on families from soaring utility bills.

Analysts at Bank of America said that under such a scenario household real income could plunge by 3.1% in 2022 compared with a year earlier, in the biggest annual drop since at least 1956, the year of the Suez crisis.
In what would mark a worse squeeze than during the oil shock of the 1970s, it comes after wholesale European gas prices rocketed on Thursday after Russian tanks rolled over the border in a full-scale invasion.

Combine this with the Climate Catastrophe and we face the worst times since the dinosaurs.

[vetran]

As mentioned by a number of wise commentators for the last 30 years being self sufficient is an important part of the countries security.

We have oil and gas in the north sea and gas underground. We have built enough green energy to deal with a small portion of our needs and no storage. We faffed around on nuclear. We could be self sufficient in energy, basic food and materials if we wanted to.

We chose to make everything in China who emit more pollutants in a day than we do in a decade and import raw materials from Russia two of the countries with the nuttiest leaders, now we pay the price. We could have worked with emerging countries and traded with them to aid their stability instead the Chinese have bought most of Africa.


Maybe we should consider that before we elect any of the current shower (both sides of the house).

[DealorNoDeal]

We could be self sufficient in energy...

I don't know about oil but we are virtually self-sufficient in gas. Trouble is, all commodity prices (energy, metals, grains etc) are determined on the world market, so being self-sufficient doesn't help with pricing. You'd need Brexit 2.0 to detach us from that.

[WTFH]

I don't know about oil but we are virtually self-sufficient in gas. Trouble is, all commodity prices (energy, metals, grains etc) are determined on the world market, so being self-sufficient doesn't help with pricing. You'd need Brexit 2.0 to detach us from that.

We ARE self sufficient in oil & gas, but only if we prevent the UK oil & gas supplies from being sold abroad. It gets sold abroad for a higher price than here, the business & shareholders are happy, and another business is then importing foreign oil & gas for less.

A free market economy can never be self sufficient because the trade will go where the profit is.

[DealorNoDeal]

A free market economy can never be self sufficient because the trade will go where the profit is.

I don't suppose there are any countries, in this day and age, that could shut themselves off from the world, and only have a free market economy within their own borders, and be self-sufficient. Although, I expect there'd be plenty in this country who'd vote for that (Brexit Max!).

[WTFH]

I don't suppose there are any countries, in this day and age, that could shut themselves off from the world, and only have a free market economy within their own borders, and be self-sufficient. Although, I expect there'd be plenty in this country who'd vote for that (Brexit Max!).

It's possible to be self sufficient in some areas, but it requires investment and management - i.e. not everything sold off to the highest bidder/closest friend.

When looking at the most self-sufficient countries for energy, they are either using green energy (solar/wind/hydro/geothermal) or that in combination with nuclear (Iceland and France are good examples)
The only country that is high on the self sufficient list for energy which uses a lot of fossil fuel is the US, which is a tad bigger than the UK.
When I read some of the "solutions" to the UK energy problem, how we need to forget about green energy and start fracking, etc, they tend to be written, not by people who look at energy, but are populists who will say anything to get coverage, but the "facts" they use are very selective.

[Paddy]

We ARE self sufficient in oil & gas, but only if we prevent the UK oil & gas supplies from being sold abroad. It gets sold abroad for a higher price than here, the business & shareholders are happy, and another business is then importing foreign oil & gas for less.

A free market economy can never be self sufficient because the trade will go where the profit is.

Oh no we are are not. The oil and gas field were sold off to private companies when the the oil and gas price was low. There is no longer any benefit to the uk

[jamesbrown]

We ARE self sufficient in oil & gas, but only if we prevent the UK oil & gas supplies from being sold abroad. It gets sold abroad for a higher price than here, the business & shareholders are happy, and another business is then importing foreign oil & gas for less.

A free market economy can never be self sufficient because the trade will go where the profit is.

Jeremy Corbyn approves this message.

What you are talking about is effectively nationalising the suppliers, whether you realise it or not. The shareholders will most definitely not be happy about state control of their profits. The UK is part of a global supply chain, so DealorNoDeal is exactly correct.

[WTFH]

Jeremy Corbyn approves this message.

What you are talking about is effectively nationalising the suppliers, whether you realise it or not. The shareholders will most definitely not be happy about state control of their profits. The UK is part of a global supply chain, so DealorNoDeal is exactly correct.

Oh, I realise exactly what I'm saying.
And it's less absurd than the suggestions of those who say "we should start fracking, we should drill for more oil & gas" - they say "we", but they mean get government investment up front, then sell off to the highest bidder as soon as possible.
China owns the debt for the nuclear power plants that the UK is getting French firms to build and the subsidies come from us.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/h...llion-uk-homes

[mattster]

So we got our revised (Shell) energy direct debit today: £365. That's over £4000 a year, with another 50% rise predicted for October to over £6000 - and worth noting that that prediction was pre-war. What it might end up now is, of course, anyone's guess. Quick straw poll of family and a few friends and we seem to be on the lower side - brother has £492 pm with cheapest fixed price deal of £982 p.m.(!) I know this is old news already, but nothing that the government has said or done reassures me that they have any grasp of just how big a shock these price rises are going to be for a lot of people. I'm annoyed by it but can pay it, many won't be so fortunate. What is going to happen at the start of next winter when the average energy cost is around £5000 a year?? It is completely nuts and uncharted territory.
Now have a year to work out how to save some energy - I wish I had taken notice of historic meter readings, since I can't seem to get them now PurePlanet are bust. I don't even know my split between electric/gas.